The Knot

James Routledge: 00:03

Welcome to the knot pod. I'm your host, James Routledge. And the knot is the home of good news for Stoke on Trent and Staffordshire. We're on a mission to change the narrative about where we live. And that's why every day, we share with you positive stories, events, things to do, and journalism that all shine a light on what's great about this place we call home.

James Routledge: 00:25

You can find us online at www.thenot dot news, where you can sign up by email to get curated, no ads, no clickbait news direct to your inbox. On this podcast, we're interviewing inspirational creatives, entrepreneurs, and leaders from across Stoke and Staffordshire. Episodes are out every other Wednesday. And you can watch the entire thing on YouTube too. Before we get into it, I'd like to thank our partners, Dissident Creative Agency and Stone, for recording and producing this podcast.

James Routledge: 00:58

Duchess China, for providing the great tea sets. And Wandering Bee for providing the candles. I hope you enjoy this episode and join the knot for everything great about Stoke on Trent and Staffordshire. So you've got shirts on that's inspired by spout designs. Yes.

James Routledge: 01:17

And then we've got the Wandering Bee candle on as always. And then we've got a Duchess China tea set. Yeah. Gladstone blue, this is. So this is this brand new.

Jenna Goodwin: 01:28

Gladstone blue. That's beautiful.

James Routledge: 01:29

Yeah. It's brand new. It's it's sort of paying homage to, like, the 100 years coming up because it's quite it's a very as far as I'm aware, it's very traditional.

Jenna Goodwin: 01:38

Yeah. Well, this is a thing into the blue, I think, is synonymous with Stoke.

James Routledge: 01:43

Do you?

Jenna Goodwin: 01:43

Yeah. Don't you?

James Routledge: 01:44

Come go a bit closer and I'll pull you. It's synonymous to you, is it?

Jenna Goodwin: 01:49

Well, I mean, if if you think of pottery and you think of Stoke on Trent, I think you think of Wedgwood's blue, Spode with the blue, obviously, Duchess. You've got Burley, haven't you, with that blue?

James Routledge: 02:03

Yeah. True.

Jenna Goodwin: 02:04

I don't know. I just think if you saw a piece of artwork on the wall or a piece of clothing like this and you were from Stoke, I feel like it's a little bit ingrained in you. Yeah. Do you know it's like when you see tiles and it you think, oh, that kinda looks like a mint and tile.

James Routledge: 02:16

I think now you've said it, yes. And I actually think it's such a beautiful design, isn't it? Yes. So, like, light and cheerful. Yeah.

James Routledge: 02:26

I'd actually love it to be used more. Because, actually, when you say Stoke to me, I do immediately think red.

Jenna Goodwin: 02:31

Interesting. I just think

James Routledge: 02:33

I think football club. I just think I think red, Stoke City Football. I mean, I'm not even a Stoke City Football fan. I just I do just think red. That's the color that comes to mind.

Jenna Goodwin: 02:42

That's strange, isn't it? Because I would have never thought red.

James Routledge: 02:45

Would you not?

Jenna Goodwin: 02:46

No. Never.

James Routledge: 02:47

See, I thought everyone thinks red.

Jenna Goodwin: 02:49

Oh, maybe we should put this out to the public.

James Routledge: 02:51

No. I think that's good. I think it's I think it's cool because I think that's such a

Jenna Goodwin: 02:55

I would think we should ask people. I'd be interested to see what color comes to mind when people think of Stoke. Yeah. Because, like, if you've got a business in Stoke and you're thinking about branding

James Routledge: 03:03

Yeah. That's a What color comes to mind when you think of Staffordshire? Green. Definitely green as well for me. I just think green fields

Jenna Goodwin: 03:11

Yeah. Green on the side. Green, everything.

James Routledge: 03:14

So when you think of Stoke, you think blue?

Jenna Goodwin: 03:16

Yeah. But like a like that specific, like,

James Routledge: 03:18

pottery blue. Sort of yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 03:19

Like Like a glazed blue.

James Routledge: 03:21

A glazed blue. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 03:22

I don't really know what that means.

James Routledge: 03:23

I think of, like, a honestly, I think of, like, a blood red.

Jenna Goodwin: 03:26

Really?

James Routledge: 03:27

Yeah. Like, I think there's something about heart and soul and grit or something. I don't know that feels

Jenna Goodwin: 03:33

I like that. But are you into football then?

James Routledge: 03:35

I like football. I've I've never supported, I never supported Stoke or Vale growing up.

Jenna Goodwin: 03:40

No. No. I mean, we all support Stoke, don't we, Wen? I mean, not really. I'm not a football supporter, but we support Stoke and Port Vale when they're in a match, don't we, like?

Jenna Goodwin: 03:49

I would love I would love yeah.

James Routledge: 03:50

I would love and I would love them both to go at the leagues. I mean, that would be I think Stoke back in the Premier League would probably won't be the biggest thing that could happen.

Jenna Goodwin: 03:58

Yeah. To be better if Port Vale could go through there, won't it? Because that'd just be a change of scenery.

James Routledge: 04:03

Either one, to be fair. Yeah. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 04:05

Yeah. But I mean, not haven't done it.

James Routledge: 04:07

People will have very strong views on it. But, yeah, for me, both those clubs doing well would be would be wicked.

Jenna Goodwin: 04:11

Or both in the Premier League and versus each other? I mean,

James Routledge: 04:14

that'd be great. That would be great. It'd

Jenna Goodwin: 04:16

be slightly different.

James Routledge: 04:17

And then, of course, other thing to say before we jump in and ask you a couple of questions is at dissident, you've just had a little tour. Dissident Crave Agency, based in stone, who produced this. Well, they record. Yeah. And we partner with them for this wonderful podcast.

James Routledge: 04:32

So, we'll give you cheers

Jenna Goodwin: 04:35

to the

James Routledge: 04:35

glads Gladstone Blue. 100 years. And it's a 100 years for Stoke on Trent next year.

Jenna Goodwin: 04:40

It's fantastic, ain't it?

James Routledge: 04:42

Are you buzzing about that?

Jenna Goodwin: 04:44

Yeah. I am. Because in recent time, I think there's been a real breakdown of the city. I think a lot of people, myself included, have even thought about what it would mean to break it back down to the 6 towns and have 6 separate councils. But now we've got a council in that I think are doing a great job.

Jenna Goodwin: 05:04

I know they've got a lot a long way to go, but it's definitely a more positive vibe now from the council. And I think it's nice to see everybody getting behind the 100 years and celebrating the unity of the city. Whereas in the previous towns, we've had a lot of breakdown and a lot of, you know, cities, like, towns versus towns. Why is one getting this? Why is one not?

Jenna Goodwin: 05:27

Whereas now it seems to be

James Routledge: 05:29

Has that changed recently?

Jenna Goodwin: 05:31

I think so. Yeah. And I think coming together next year and celebrating the 100 years of the city will also bring people together. I don't see how it can't, to be honest. It's one big thing that we're all celebrating into.

James Routledge: 05:42

It's a big birthday party, isn't it? Because you're actually pretty much everyone else I've had on the podcast so far has left and come back. So you're the first believe. Yeah. You're the first person I've chatted to on the pod that's, yeah, that's I'm assuming you've never

Jenna Goodwin: 05:59

I mean, I live in teen at the moment, which is technically Stoke on Trent.

James Routledge: 06:04

Yeah. You still

Jenna Goodwin: 06:06

seem happy about that at all. Strange place. Yeah. So it's got small villages in there.

James Routledge: 06:11

Feel that severe to you that, like, you would love to be within the official boundaries of Stoke on Trent?

Jenna Goodwin: 06:17

Yeah. To be honest, the problem I've got is with having horses, and I live reasonably rural.

James Routledge: 06:24

Mhmm.

Jenna Goodwin: 06:24

There's not really many places in Stoke that you can do that. So we want to live on the outskirts of the Peak District, but close enough that I can stay in Stoke, if that makes sense. Yeah. So I know I'm not necessarily going to live there, but I I would never be able to move far away from Stoke. I mean, my entire family's there.

Jenna Goodwin: 06:43

My business is there, all my friends, all the businesses that I know, the places that I know, it's I don't know. Gets me boned.

James Routledge: 06:50

It was Bentley you grew up in?

Jenna Goodwin: 06:51

No. Abbey Hunter. No. Abbey Hunter. I went to school in Bentley.

Jenna Goodwin: 06:54

I went to Mitchell High School.

James Routledge: 06:55

Got you. So what's have you felt like Stokes changed since you like, in your life? Like, how how have you Yeah. Yeah. How have you witnessed that?

Jenna Goodwin: 07:07

Well, you've got a lot of people at the moment that are saying that we've got a lot of druggies and a lot of problems and a lot of crime, and I'm like, really? Do we think that's quite high now compared to when I was young? Because I grew up in Abbey, Houghton and Bentleigh, which is one of the biggest council estates in Europe. And don't get me wrong. It was a nice place to grow up.

Jenna Goodwin: 07:28

It was friendly. But there was a lot of crime. There was a lot of drugs. There was, you know and

James Routledge: 07:34

And what year is this?

Jenna Goodwin: 07:36

Like, the nineties. Nineties. Yeah. Well, I was born in 1987.

James Routledge: 07:38

Okay.

Jenna Goodwin: 07:39

So the nineties, early nineties. And it was just normal to us. It, you know, it was it never caused a problem. But and then I see people now moaning about the handful of druggies and people that we've got in city centers. And I'm like, have you been to other cities recently?

Jenna Goodwin: 07:58

We've got a very, very small problem. It just seems to be the media that's blown it out of proportion. And I'm not saying it's not a problem. Don't get me wrong. I'm absolutely not saying that we don't have an issue.

Jenna Goodwin: 08:09

But it's nowhere near what it was like when I was younger when it people were openly dealing drugs and openly committing crimes. It's not like that anymore. So it's a much more positive place to live. It's a much safer place to walk around at night. And I say that as a woman.

Jenna Goodwin: 08:22

Mhmm. I don't ever feel particularly worried. I go out at night in Stoke and take photographs, carry my camera with me. And I always just get people speaking to me. Oh, what you doing?

Jenna Goodwin: 08:31

Hey, Oakley, you're alright? You know, it's I don't it's not a horrible place to walk around at night. Would I do the same in Birmingham or Manchester? I don't think I would.

James Routledge: 08:42

Mhmm. What what's changed then? Because or what's because that your opinion actually is you're in the I'd say, yeah, actually, you've got, like, a minority opinion there currently, it seems to me, from what we see maybe online or, like, the general discourse around Stoke. So what what's the disconnect, do you think? Because, like, you're painting a picture of, actually, it's it's got better, on some on some aspects.

James Routledge: 09:11

But the the general narrative is Stoke has got worse. That Is it? That's what it feels like to many people, or at least that's what I notice of people talking about, whether it's children in care or, average wages, you know, state of the high streets. There does seem to be a general narrative online, I would say, that is, yeah, negative towards towards Stoke.

Jenna Goodwin: 09:41

Yeah. I think you've got to weigh things up. So social care, social housing, children in care are all worse. Yeah. But that's not just Stoke.

Jenna Goodwin: 09:51

Yeah. That's a lack of funding from central government, and every city's having a problem. I think Stoke's got the most children in care across in the whole country. But, again, I I don't think that is just a specific problem to one town. I think it's something that is across the board an issue.

Jenna Goodwin: 10:08

We just happen to have the most children in care because we're a lower income area. You know? We always have been. But when you talk about online and the media and things like that, there's only, like, a certain demographic of people in Stoke that voice their me their their opinions online. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 10:29

And they are always saying that it's worse now than it was, and it's worse than it ever was, and there's no jobs and blah blah blah blah. There's probably more jobs in Stoke now than there was than there has been since the pottery industry imploded, but they're better paid. They are how do I explain what I mean? So when the pottery industry was booming and the tires were being made at Michelin and places like that, do they think that we still didn't have mass unemployment? Do they think that children still didn't go without food?

Jenna Goodwin: 11:03

Do they think that you know, back then, you could have a husband and a wife and 17 kids and live on one man's wage. You'd be poor, but you'd all have something on your plate. Try that now. Yeah. One man and one woman or whatever can't afford to both work full time and have one child at the moment.

Jenna Goodwin: 11:22

That I that's worse. Mhmm. But at the same time, the cost of living's gone up for everything. Back then, people were quite happy renting a 2 up, 2 down terraced house. Now are people worse off?

Jenna Goodwin: 11:34

Or is it because they've all got brand new phones, brand new you know, they go off a brand new house, gotta have a car and finance? It's hard, ain't it? Yeah. Because the poorest of the poor haven't got them.

James Routledge: 11:44

So It's hard it's hard to know.

Jenna Goodwin: 11:45

It's hard to measure it.

James Routledge: 11:46

It's hard to measure decline or change or whatever. But you're saying from your perspective, actually

Jenna Goodwin: 11:51

talking from, like, crime and Yeah. And drugs and things like that. I don't think

James Routledge: 11:55

You feel like it's a safer

Jenna Goodwin: 11:57

Yeah.

James Routledge: 11:58

Quote, unquote better place to live than it was when you were growing up.

Jenna Goodwin: 12:02

And then we talk about the high street declining. Of course, the high street's declining. But up until 19 fifties, the high street wasn't particularly a hugely popular thing. It was only because people lived so close and they couldn't drive that all the shops just ended up in one place. Once everybody learned how to drive, that's when shopping centers became a thing.

Jenna Goodwin: 12:21

And malls and things like that, you know, the sixties seventies, and they started having out of town shopping complexes happened in America as well. Mhmm. They were gonna kill the high street, weren't they? Yeah. And then we all moaned that HMV was taking the money from the record companies, and they all shut down.

Jenna Goodwin: 12:37

Yeah. And now we're moaning that HMV's gone off the high street. But we all bought from HMV who killed the record shop, and now we're all buying off Amazon who killed HMV. So it's our fault. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 12:47

Yeah. And the high streets are also declining because, let's be honest, do would you prefer to go somewhere in your car, go in 3 shops, and go home and have free parking, or go and park in Hanley on the pottery shopping center and pay, like, £1.50 an hour, walk for 25 minutes to get to the 1st shop, carry all your stuff around. Which would you rather

James Routledge: 13:06

go to a retail park, aren't you? Yeah. It's it's a better it's a better shopping experience if you're gonna or

Jenna Goodwin: 13:11

I'm gonna

James Routledge: 13:11

buy it on Amazon, Correct. Basically.

Jenna Goodwin: 13:13

I think what the biggest problem is is when we've got places like Hanley Market and independent shops, not putting them on retail parks. Mhmm. Why are we not taking big industrial units and splitting them into multi shop places? Yeah. Why are we not taking all of the stores from somewhere like Hanley Market and putting them in a retail unit at Festival Park?

Jenna Goodwin: 13:31

If that's where all the shoppers are,

James Routledge: 13:33

move the

Jenna Goodwin: 13:33

shops there.

James Routledge: 13:33

Towards that. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 13:34

And then makes the city center of Hanley residential, like offices or something.

James Routledge: 13:38

When did you start having, like, all of these opinions on on Stoke and stuff? Like, as it developed over the

Jenna Goodwin: 13:44

years ago. Felt like this. Yeah. Yeah. It's I think living here and being in the thick of it for my hand entire life I mean, you gotta remember, I'm the first person in my whole family that's not worked on a pot bank.

Jenna Goodwin: 13:56

I'm the first person that hasn't worked out a mine. You know what I mean? I Yeah. My family went through everything. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 14:02

The miner strikes, the pottery industry declining. I had family that used to when they started sending stuff abroad, they used to bring it home and paint them, you know, because we're on piece work. And then I've watched how it's affected everyone in my family to lose their jobs and have to go and do things that they weren't used to doing and try new things. And it was it was hard. But I also watch things like how they shop and how they interact with Stoke because they're just normal working class people.

Jenna Goodwin: 14:34

And I can't even tell you the the last time anyone in my family went to Huntley. And there's no malice in it. There's no reason in it. It's just that some people in my family are disabled, and they can't walk that far. My nan, before she passed away, she was probably she went to Hanley once a week.

Jenna Goodwin: 14:51

She went to Bingo, and then they moved the bus station. Why? Yeah. Why would you do that?

James Routledge: 14:57

So you've She couldn't get there then. You've had your family that have been in Stoke a long time, worked in the industries of Stoke, and you've seen how that's changed. What I just find fascinating, and I suppose I'm just keeping prodding, is, like, I feel like a lot of people would respond to that and go, oh, this place, it's a joke or blame. Like and I don't hear any blame in you. I don't hear, like, maybe you've got a

Jenna Goodwin: 15:22

few people that you like. I'm not naive, though. I mean, I understand that it's not the best place in the world to live. I understand that. I do.

Jenna Goodwin: 15:32

But isn't it? If you're gonna live in the city let's pretend you're a city dweller and you're a city person. And you say, right. I wanna live in the city. I want to have the opportunities that a city will bring.

James Routledge: 15:43

Yeah. I'm moving to Manchester.

Jenna Goodwin: 15:44

Yeah. But you're not. You're staying in stone.

James Routledge: 15:47

Oh, okay. Right.

Jenna Goodwin: 15:48

So let's say you did move to Manchester. Okay? All of a sudden, everything that you do now costs 10 times more. Mhmm. There are more people.

Jenna Goodwin: 15:56

There are less jobs. There are less opportunities. I know that there's more opportunities, but there's also more people.

James Routledge: 16:03

Yeah. I'm competing Yeah. More for them.

Jenna Goodwin: 16:04

You're gonna pay more to live. You're gonna pay more to drive. You're gonna pay more for public transport, more for parking, more for food, more for shopping. All of these things come at a price, more for your council tax. If you've got goals, if you've got things that you want to achieve, if you want to start a business, or if you want to buy a house or start a family, why wouldn't you do Etonstoke?

Jenna Goodwin: 16:26

Yeah. It's cheap. Mhmm. It's nice. It's friendly.

Jenna Goodwin: 16:29

We've got all of the things that a big city has got, but on a much smaller scale. There's a lot more green spaces, a lot more sports, you know, leisure centers, places to walk, the canal, the train lines, things like that. A lot more free things. If you go to a city, there's not a lot of things that you can do for free.

James Routledge: 16:45

Do you feel like one of the problems is that we're we often compare Stoke to other cities, and it's a difficult comparison, isn't it? Because

Jenna Goodwin: 16:54

No. I don't think that. I think I don't think we compare Stoke to big cities enough.

James Routledge: 16:58

Oh, okay.

Jenna Goodwin: 16:59

Because if you were to choose where you were gonna live, if you wanted to live in a city, would you choose Stoke, or would you choose London? And why?

James Routledge: 17:05

Yeah. And you don't yeah. And then maybe, Jasmine, your point there is that people aren't seeing the good. Yeah. And so I think I think that's what I'm getting.

James Routledge: 17:13

I feel like people are often looking at Stoke and and why the Staffordshire Yeah. And seeing everything it doesn't have.

Jenna Goodwin: 17:18

Yeah.

James Routledge: 17:18

And seeing all of these little intricacies, like, the fact that Stoke on Trent in particular is is made up of £6 is extremely unique in its in its, geography. It's not a Friday, people keep telling me. Yeah. It's not a big circle. Yeah.

James Routledge: 17:32

Manchester's a big circle. That's why there's no green space in Manchester because you you have to get out the circle to get to it. Same with London. And, like, other than a few parks, you gotta get out the big, big circle of Greater London Yeah. To get to Kent or Surrey to even see a field, really.

James Routledge: 17:46

Whereas Sloane train's very unique in that perspective. You could be in Hanley, and you can go 20 minutes, and you could probably be in fields. Or But

Jenna Goodwin: 17:54

you can go 5 minutes down the canal

James Routledge: 17:56

Exact yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 17:57

In any of our in any of our towns when you're in the countryside.

James Routledge: 18:00

Yeah. Exactly. So you can always always find it. So those there's there's those, like, unique aspects. But I feel like a lot of the the discourse and the narrative, I think, from young people as well as I think there's older generation who've seen the area change and are grieved and upset about that.

James Routledge: 18:16

And then there are, I think, young people, which I would I would have classed myself in this, that feel like this the place isn't giving them the opportunities or the life that they want Yeah. Because they're just seeing what what's not there. Yeah. Yeah. And I think a lot of people are seeing what what we've not got Yeah.

James Routledge: 18:33

Rather than maybe

Jenna Goodwin: 18:33

what we've got. It trickles down. So if you look at the older generation, they lived in the height of, like, the pottery industry before it imploded. Yeah. But I wouldn't have said that Stoke was a particularly nice place then because I mean, we're talking back in the fifties now before the Clean Air Act came in.

Jenna Goodwin: 18:53

You couldn't even breathe when you lived here.

James Routledge: 18:56

Oh, my dad tells me that he used to go and sit on a hill and see smoke.

Jenna Goodwin: 19:00

Yeah. Yeah.

James Routledge: 19:01

You know?

Jenna Goodwin: 19:01

Yeah. We've only got a look at old William Blake photographs. He was a long term photographer. He did a lot of, postcards of Stoke on Trent. And you've seen it, say, you're high from Smokey Stoke on Trent and things like that.

Jenna Goodwin: 19:15

But they thought they nostalgia is a really dangerous thing, I find. We're all nostalgic, aren't we? I look at back some things from the nineties, and I'm like, oh, it was brilliant. And then, you know, Tomb Raider and Yeah. And then you play it, and you're like, wow.

Jenna Goodwin: 19:28

This is really crap.

James Routledge: 19:29

Yeah. Do you

Jenna Goodwin: 19:29

know what I mean? So

James Routledge: 19:30

it's just a fun stuff. We reminisce about the glory days of night owl apparently and Yeah. But if I will I don't fancy a night owl.

Jenna Goodwin: 19:37

No. But, I mean, let's go back to the fifties. Women couldn't have a bank account. Men worked 15 hours a day. No one could breathe.

Jenna Goodwin: 19:45

Everyone died of lung disease. We all lived in damp houses. We didn't have double glazing. Your kids were out from god knows what time till what time. You didn't know where they were.

Jenna Goodwin: 19:54

And let's not pretend that there was no crime and no predators and, you know, none of that because there absolutely was. There was just no social media. Yeah. Which is I think why crime is more widely reported now is because it's all on social media. Back in the day, you had a newspaper.

Jenna Goodwin: 20:09

And if it wasn't important, it didn't go in the newspaper. And then you've got all the way through the years, all this nostalgia of these older people who lost what they thought was a simpler, nicer time. But it was simpler. I'll give them that. And then that's trickled down to when the industry imploded and they became disillusioned with the world.

Jenna Goodwin: 20:27

And I think they've passed that down to the next generations because, like, when I was young and when you were young, it was a pretty poor place to grow up. It was poor. We we didn't have any money. It was not a rich area. There wasn't loads of opportunities.

Jenna Goodwin: 20:44

But now there are 100 and 100 and 100 of start up businesses in Stoke on Trent because office space is cheap, transport's easy, we're right off the m 6, you know, things like that. So if you are a young person now, there are loads of jobs and opportunities in Stoke on Trent. I think we were like the transitional period, watching my family struggle after the implode and then coming up the other side. But I've never struggled to find a job in Stoke. Mhmm.

Jenna Goodwin: 21:14

I think there's that many businesses here from huge national chains right down to small independents. I don't think that's any different to any other city. I don't think there's less opportunities. I think there's more. Because let's say you wanted to start a business in Stoke, and you wanted a a studio or an office space or something like that.

Jenna Goodwin: 21:35

Where else in the country is it as affordable as it is here? Yeah. You know, if you go to Manchester and you wanna rent, like, an attic office space, how much are you talking? Because it's out of the budget of most start up businesses, isn't it? What's what's

James Routledge: 21:48

what, like, what's your opinion then on just the the state of the state of the area? Like, what, you know, how is it is it because I'm picking up that you're like, actually, we all need to sort of refresh our, you know, refresh our mindset and look at look honestly at what we've got and be kind of appreciative of that and use that as our advantage and also break through this noise and really challenges it as bad as everyone's saying it is. Yeah. What's your genuine take on just the state of affairs? Like, what would you like to see change in in across Stoke and maybe also maybe North Staffordshire as well?

James Routledge: 22:30

Like, are you happy with how it is? Do you want, like yeah. How would you if I made you the the mayor, like, what would you change? Like

Jenna Goodwin: 22:37

I'm not happy with how it is. I think it'd be really naive to say that Stoke is, like, the best place in the world. I just think that there's a lot of positives, and people only focus on the negatives. Yeah. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 22:48

I think we need to focus on both equally. Yeah. So, yes, there are a lot of good things about Stoke, but there's also a lot of things that really need improving. Mhmm. The first one's the state of the roads.

James Routledge: 22:58

That'd be your first.

Jenna Goodwin: 22:59

Ugh. Well, I drive old cars. So let me just tell you, if you're wanging about Stoke in a Range Rover, you probably haven't noticed the fact that there's no tarmac on the roads. But then on the positive side, the council have said that they're gonna fix, like, 6,000 potholes this year. So for me, let's give them chance to do that.

Jenna Goodwin: 23:16

Yeah. Let's see if they do it. Let's see if it works. And then we've got obviously social care, housing. The council are doing a big thing at the moment with molding council houses and social reforms for children and things like that.

Jenna Goodwin: 23:29

So, again, yes, that's an issue, but it is on the agenda to be repaired. Yeah. The things that I think I would repair is we've got a huge problem in Stoke at the moment where we've got no media. There's no central source of media that isn't hugely negative. Mhmm.

Jenna Goodwin: 23:46

We either need something to change. We need something that is not even necessarily just positive, something that's just not negative all the time, something that somewhere that tells you what's on and who's doing what and things like that and, you know, interesting news and stuff like that. That's one thing. And then I think the other thing that I would change is I think people really need to start taking care of their own spaces. So if you drive down a street, everyone's got, like, a garden or a front door or something like that, and shops and offices are still the same.

Jenna Goodwin: 24:26

You dry and drive down a high street and all the weeds poking out the side of the building, the window frames flaking. If everybody just took good care of their own little space.

James Routledge: 24:36

Yeah. A bit more pride in

Jenna Goodwin: 24:38

Yeah. If you go down to if you go to local villages, the one like Britain in Bloom and Yeah.

James Routledge: 24:42

It's well kept, isn't it? Because each individual person is taking pride in their area. And that that I feel like that's the thread through what you're talking about. It's Yeah. It's taking pride reclaiming

Jenna Goodwin: 24:53

Taking ownership of

James Routledge: 24:54

Taking ownership of of the place that we're all living and we're all from and, you know, really treat really believing that we're sort of custodians of it. Because one thing I certainly noticed since I've since I came back is, obviously, I had that peer you know, grew up when I was young and then left for a period. I mean, in the other cities I've lived in, I've never ever heard anyone talk about the council. Not even joking. I've lived in Sheffield, Newcastle, London, spent a lot of time in Manchester.

James Routledge: 25:23

I've genuinely never heard anyone mention

Jenna Goodwin: 25:25

the council

James Routledge: 25:25

Mhmm. When they lived there. It's it's maybe the council is their councils are so good that people don't notice them. But I just think people are, like, cracking on with it. And I feel like there's some sort of culture here of, Yeah.

James Routledge: 25:42

Expect expecting that the council do everything.

Jenna Goodwin: 25:45

Do you not think that that's maybe the size of the city? So, like, in a large city, the council just do what they're doing. But if you go down to a village and have a parish council, most people in the village know the people on the parish council, and there's usually some weird politics going on. I wouldn't be almost we're only just a step above a town, aren't we really?

James Routledge: 26:05

True. True.

Jenna Goodwin: 26:05

We're 6 towns, and we are a city, but we're not a city city. We're not like London, Manchester, Birmingham, and Liverpool. So maybe but do you not think that that could be a positive thing, that the council can get involved with the citizens of the the city and learn what they want? And then

James Routledge: 26:22

Only if the citizens also are willing to engage, though. I don't think that's that's I suppose I'm back to your point. I I think I do think we do need to develop a lot of ownership and pride, and and people believe in, like, this is my place, and I get to have a say. And, you know, Yeah. I'm not I someone said to me the other day, as a little aside, they were out, litter picking in, I can't remember, even Newcastle or Orhanley, and they were in enjoying it.

James Routledge: 26:51

They were doing it as like a a thing that they wanted to do to contribute to the area. And someone asks, like, oh, do you work for the council? And they said, no. Like, I'm just volunteering off my own back to do it. And then the person who asked got really angry.

James Routledge: 27:07

Like, oh, the council should be doing it. And Why don't

Jenna Goodwin: 27:10

you pick your own letter

James Routledge: 27:11

up? And no one has to do it. Person was like, yeah. Well, I'm picking up, like, your lit not your lit but, you know, so I just thought that was a really that's a really interested interaction that I think kinda sums it up.

Jenna Goodwin: 27:22

Well, think I I think people think that the council yeah. Thank you. I think people think that the council are like a magical pot of money. It's like I don't know back in the fifties that you might have been able to get someone to lick a litter pick for 20 pence a day. I don't know.

Jenna Goodwin: 27:39

But right now, we've got minimum wages in this country. And paying someone to litter pick isn't just like, you know, I have a bit of cash in your hand for doing some litter picking. That's a full time job for somebody. Mhmm. That's a hue a whole full time wage that the council has got to find just for someone to pick lettuce.

James Routledge: 27:54

What's gonna

Jenna Goodwin: 27:54

just But you could just not

James Routledge: 27:56

drop it in litter.

Jenna Goodwin: 27:57

And then we wouldn't need that.

James Routledge: 27:58

And drop it and litter, I think, like

Jenna Goodwin: 28:01

I hate littering.

James Routledge: 28:01

Oh, it it says everything, doesn't it? It says everything.

Jenna Goodwin: 28:03

Inside of my car tells you how much I hate littering.

James Routledge: 28:06

Litter says everything about what you feel about where you live at.

Jenna Goodwin: 28:09

Correct.

James Routledge: 28:09

And what you've maybe feel about yourself also. Yes. Now what's what's contributed that to that then, do you believe? Like, what

Jenna Goodwin: 28:15

What we've already been talking about.

James Routledge: 28:17

Do you think it's all just that history of, like

Jenna Goodwin: 28:20

For me, there's a few things that need to be rectified before anything's gonna change in this city. The first one is how people perceive the city. So if they don't like the city, they are going to drop litter, like you say, and they're gonna moan online. But then in order to change that, you've got to have some way of telling them that the things are good, which comes back to what I said about the media. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 28:43

And the positivity and, you know, sharing news, sharing events, sharing things. Yeah. And that is only gonna be done if people put on these things. So businesses sharing events, you know, the museums putting on events, green spaces being advertised, and people using them.

James Routledge: 29:02

Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 29:02

All of them three things combined, I think, will make people realize

James Routledge: 29:06

You've got almost creative contributions.

Jenna Goodwin: 29:10

Yeah.

James Routledge: 29:10

So whether it's businesses, spaces, restaurants, people, just doing stuff.

Jenna Goodwin: 29:15

Doing stuff. What I hear.

James Routledge: 29:16

Yeah. Doing things. Yeah. Doing

Jenna Goodwin: 29:17

Not just opening a business and going, please

James Routledge: 29:19

do this. Doing things. Events. Creating things. Making things.

James Routledge: 29:23

Getting, you know, stuff products or experiences. Yes. Then being able to tell people about all those things. And then you believe that people will have a, and I agree, a more positive experience

Jenna Goodwin: 29:35

Yeah.

James Routledge: 29:35

Of the place and and develop more.

Jenna Goodwin: 29:37

Because it's not just about how a city looks. There aren't really any beautiful cities. There are beautiful places within those cities. But if you go from the middle before you get to the outside, it's usually pretty grim in most cities. Let's be honest.

James Routledge: 29:51

Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 29:52

We're lucky that we don't really have that because we're split into 6 towns. So you said about the Friday Yeah. Situation. Yeah. We don't have that, like, external part of the city.

Jenna Goodwin: 30:01

We've got towns Mhmm. Residential homes, little shopping boats. And it's all sort of a mismatch. And I don't think anywhere particularly looks awful. I think there's a few patches of dereliction that need to be tidied up and a few places where the the buildings are crumbling and do need to

James Routledge: 30:19

be carried. Where where are those for you? Where are your top? If you could sort of blitz and sort out, say, 3 areas, what would you go for?

Jenna Goodwin: 30:26

Tunstall High Street, Longton High Street, to a lesser degree, and the third one would probably be Hanley City Centre. So the actual the first thing I'd do is I would rip all the pedestrian eyes, bit out of Hanley because I think it's too difficult for people to get to where they want to go. I think if you could pull up and have 30 minutes free parking on most of the streets in Hanley, people would nip up more often. And if they could nip up and see what was there Yeah. There's more chance of a car.

James Routledge: 31:00

A load of free buses or cheap buses or whatever.

Jenna Goodwin: 31:03

Yeah. Parking I mean, I don't really see why we need a parking ride in Stoke. Like, you know but, yeah, that sort of thing. Yeah.

James Routledge: 31:09

What's your opinion on that public transport? Because that's

Jenna Goodwin: 31:11

I didn't pass my driving test till I was 21. So I used public transport for the car ride.

James Routledge: 31:16

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And And what about now? What would you have?

James Routledge: 31:19

Would you tram?

Jenna Goodwin: 31:20

Tram. Well, to be honest, I think one of the biggest losses in the history of Stoke on Trent was losing the trams. I really do.

James Routledge: 31:29

So we had trams. Oh, yeah. Until when?

Jenna Goodwin: 31:32

I think it was about the forties, fifties.

James Routledge: 31:34

Wow.

Jenna Goodwin: 31:35

We're the Potteries Electric Tram Company, and it went between every single town. It went to, like, up Vicky Road, up City Road, up Litchfield Street to Hanley, Tunstall, everywhere. And you could get anywhere in Stoke on a train or a tram. Right. Because obviously you got the loop line.

James Routledge: 31:51

And then what happened? Do you know?

Jenna Goodwin: 31:53

No. Just No idea. It just just closed, and they just ripped them all up. But it was the age of the car I wanted. They were looking to the future.

Jenna Goodwin: 32:01

They thought that cars were going to be the future, and they are. They weren't wrong. But now there's too many cars, and people don't like them again. Mhmm.

James Routledge: 32:09

Because your your thing is history, isn't it? So you know I see you're a historian in my mind. It's like, you know the you know the area and the history of it like the back of your hands. And you've you know, you post online, and you go and visit places, and you find out the history of buildings in particular. Mhmm.

James Routledge: 32:23

I'm I'm I feel like that's your particular interest.

Jenna Goodwin: 32:27

I just like them because they're tangible.

James Routledge: 32:29

Yeah. Building them and, like, things.

Jenna Goodwin: 32:30

The building's things and the stories around them. Yeah. Because, like, it's people are interesting, but, like, people live in buildings and multiple people live in buildings. And things happen, and it's easier to see what it looks like now. And

James Routledge: 32:44

And given what you know then about the his like, all of Stoke and Staffordshire history from everything, from ceramics, you know, and you go further back than that, like, yes. I feel like you go into, you know, the Anglo Saxon area with this,

Jenna Goodwin: 33:01

you know. Back to the Romans and yeah.

James Routledge: 33:03

What do you what do you see as the future, like, if you sort of could paint a picture from the past to now and beyond. Yeah. How would you do that?

Jenna Goodwin: 33:13

What what do I think Stokes' gonna be?

James Routledge: 33:15

Yeah. What's gonna happen?

Jenna Goodwin: 33:15

I think Stokes' gonna be the next Silicon Valley.

James Routledge: 33:18

You actually you actually think that.

Jenna Goodwin: 33:19

How many tech companies do you know that have started in Stokes recently?

James Routledge: 33:23

I don't know. Bet365?

Jenna Goodwin: 33:25

No. Small ones. I don't

James Routledge: 33:27

know that

Jenna Goodwin: 33:27

many. I do. Do you? We're sitting in one for a start. That's creative agency.

Jenna Goodwin: 33:32

Same for

James Routledge: 33:33

what you actually said. You actually think that will happen? I'm not I'm not being nice.

Jenna Goodwin: 33:37

If you go back and look at California and Yeah. Like Silicon Valley, they they started to go there because the rent was cheap. Yeah. And land was accessible. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 33:44

Buildings were easy.

James Routledge: 33:45

Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 33:45

Is that not where we are now with Stoke? Mhmm. We are in the center of the country. Yeah. There isn't a single place in England that is better situated for travel than Stoke on Trent.

Jenna Goodwin: 33:55

Yeah. Trains, m 6. We nearly had an airport. That's one of the other losses that we had was Mia Airport. But I honestly think

James Routledge: 34:04

So Mia nearly had an airport?

Jenna Goodwin: 34:06

Yeah. Check it out on my website. Mia had an aerodrome. Yeah. Right up until 50.

James Routledge: 34:11

Well, like a proper airport.

Jenna Goodwin: 34:12

It was an aerodrome.

James Routledge: 34:13

It was an aerodrome. Okay.

Jenna Goodwin: 34:14

So it was an airport.

James Routledge: 34:15

Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 34:15

They they started doing commercial flights from it after the war. Really? Yeah.

James Routledge: 34:19

Yeah. Wow.

Jenna Goodwin: 34:20

Yeah. We've even had royalty come on land here to go to the Portbanks. No way. Yeah. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 34:25

It's quite an interesting one. Then it was a glider club for a long time. But the count I don't think the council ever quite had the foresight. And it genuinely was the council that voted against it because it's in all the Sentinel records and stuff.

James Routledge: 34:36

To turn it into a commercial airport?

Jenna Goodwin: 34:38

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They were saying it wasn't worth doing.

James Routledge: 34:41

So you believe the future is it's cheap right now. It's really well located.

Jenna Goodwin: 34:48

It's like I keep saying

James Routledge: 34:49

to you.

Jenna Goodwin: 34:49

Feel like do you feel like that

James Routledge: 34:51

means that people will be drawn here or other people You you do.

Jenna Goodwin: 34:54

Yeah. I mean, if you look at you've got 2 types of businesses, aren't you? You've got startup businesses and established businesses. Now if you've got a startup business, does the first thing that most people need is office space and customers.

James Routledge: 35:09

Mhmm.

Jenna Goodwin: 35:09

Well, we've got customers. We're a city. But we don't have city prices for the buildings, for the rent. Even to purchase a building or land to build your own building, there isn't really anywhere in the UK that's cheaper than Stoke on Trent right now. But on the other hand, if you are an experienced brand, if you are a long term business, and you are a lot of people are working hybrid at the moment.

Jenna Goodwin: 35:35

But let's say that they're in Manchester, and they're paying an extortionate amount of money for a building, and they want to expand, and they need another building, and they need more staff. A lot of businesses are leaving cities. Mhmm. A lot of them in droves, actually, because they can't afford the rent. I'm using Manchester specifically because Manchester's risen so quickly that it is actually outpricing a lot of the people that are there.

Jenna Goodwin: 36:00

Yeah. So if you're in Manchester, you can't go to Birmingham because it's the same problem. You definitely can't go to London because that problem started 20 years ago. So where'd you go?

James Routledge: 36:10

So you see a creative, entrepreneurial

Jenna Goodwin: 36:13

Haven't we always been?

James Routledge: 36:14

Future. Yeah. Well, like, yeah, that's what I was I was lean I was leaning into that. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 36:18

That's that's what I think. I think we, as a city, we've got so many artists and creators and creative people here already that if you are thinking about somewhere creative to go, why would you not come here and have a lovely office on the canal or, you know, build an entire building like that 365 has for less than you could have done anywhere else in the country.

James Routledge: 36:42

Yeah. Yeah. And I feel like re retapping into that story is powerful. You know? You re like, sort of re not reincarnating Wedgwood and these other pioneers, but just drawing inspiration from them.

James Routledge: 36:56

Like, I I knew nothing about Wedgwood growing up. Like, I didn't I must have heard of Wedgwood, but I didn't know he was such a pioneer in, force and also

Jenna Goodwin: 37:05

Unspoed?

James Routledge: 37:06

Yeah. Unspoed. Oh. Minton. Minton.

James Routledge: 37:08

Yeah. Like

Jenna Goodwin: 37:09

yeah. They weren't just potters. This is the thing. People people think, oh, you know, they made pots. No.

Jenna Goodwin: 37:14

They didn't.

James Routledge: 37:15

What's the most unlike is there a particular you know, interesting story about either of those that you think is not not well known?

Jenna Goodwin: 37:23

Not really. I mean, it's I think I think today, we all know and appreciate the history of these people. I think but when you look at pottery and we look at how things were made and the entrepreneurial, I don't think people realize that, like, Josiah Wedgwood was not a potter. He was an entrepreneur. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 37:45

He was Unlike a scientist. Yeah. Like, I was gonna say, you you think about making a cup, and, like, now we just you make a cup and you put it in a kiln and you glaze it and whatnot. And it's it's not I'm not gonna say it's not difficult, but if you go back, like, 2, 300 years, you would need an entire factory and a workforce to make that cup. And the science involved, even from getting the clay out of the ground and the texture and the water density and stuff, And then they got no, like, scientific instruments.

Jenna Goodwin: 38:18

There was no digital anything that you could use. This was something that they all just knew and passed the knowledge on and learned. And

James Routledge: 38:25

Yeah. They were proper, like, tinkerers and engineers.

Jenna Goodwin: 38:28

Yeah. And he was the guy that, like, figured out what to put in to create because he he went to China and wanted transporting bone china. Transporting china from China, it was translucent. It was that delicate. And, obviously, a lot of the times, it didn't make the journey.

Jenna Goodwin: 38:44

So he wanted to make something that everyday people could use bone china. And we now know that he made bone china. But, like, what did he do to make that? Like, where'd you even start? Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 38:55

How many things did he put in the clay?

James Routledge: 38:57

And how many things did he break and

Jenna Goodwin: 38:59

Yeah.

James Routledge: 38:59

Fail at and and experiment. And and Wedgwood isn't the only one. You know?

Jenna Goodwin: 39:03

No. I mean, look at Thomas Wedgwood. He invented photography. Mhmm. What?

Jenna Goodwin: 39:06

Photography was invented in Stoke on Trent. What what

James Routledge: 39:10

do you mean? You

Jenna Goodwin: 39:11

don't know that.

James Routledge: 39:11

No.

Jenna Goodwin: 39:12

So Thomas Wedgwood. Yeah. Younger than Josiah Wedgwood.

James Routledge: 39:17

Yeah. His son or brother? Or

Jenna Goodwin: 39:19

No. He's, like, his nephew

James Routledge: 39:21

or something.

Jenna Goodwin: 39:23

So he was a tinkerer. Again, the whole family tinkered with all the weird stuff. Some of them were engineers. Some of them, you know, painted. You know?

Jenna Goodwin: 39:36

Even the women were really into but I think it comes from the fact that they were quite a wealthy family, and they could do this. Yeah. But yeah. So Thomas Wedgewood basically wanted to create a permanent image, but he could never get it to fix. So when you take a photograph in a dark room so he created, like, a pinhole that would no.

Jenna Goodwin: 39:58

Sorry. He created so, basically, if you get a piece of paper, a piece of photo paper

James Routledge: 40:02

Mhmm.

Jenna Goodwin: 40:03

It's got a chemical on the top. If you put something on the top of it and turn the light on and then turn the light off and move the thing, it will leave a mark of where it's been. And then as soon as you turn the light on, the whole page goes black. What he he figured that out, he figured out the chemical to put on to create an image so you can put leaves on and things like that. And then what he did is he would do, like, a silhouette of his head.

Jenna Goodwin: 40:28

So he'd open the window. It would silhouette. And then he never figured out how to fix it. So then you dip it in another chemical, and it creates a permanent image. I'm trying to explain it simply.

Jenna Goodwin: 40:40

I'm not getting to it too terribly. It was actually a guy in France that finished it Mhmm. Who it turns out did correspond with Wedgwood. And Thomas Wedgwood actually corresponded with other people. There's letters in the Wedgwood collection talking about and the that are dated talking about his experiments with photography, and they are earlier than anyone else ever did.

James Routledge: 41:04

It's interesting, isn't it? Because I But

Jenna Goodwin: 41:06

he died really young, which is why he never did it.

James Routledge: 41:08

I feel like there are so many entrepreneurial stories in this area that aren't just ceramics. And I do sometimes think ceramics takes a bit Yeah. Too much of the limelight. Obviously, we know Reginald Mitchell and the Spitfire, but I've never heard that story.

Jenna Goodwin: 41:28

Yeah. I have written about it.

James Routledge: 41:30

And I never knew that

Jenna Goodwin: 41:31

But I never made a video about it.

James Routledge: 41:32

I never knew that this industrialist or the or or someone from this great industrialist family was all also played a part in pioneering photography. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 41:40

Like, we wouldn't be sitting here with any of these cameras if he hadn't

James Routledge: 41:43

done his tinker.

Jenna Goodwin: 41:44

About with what he was doing. Yeah.

James Routledge: 41:46

Are there other little stuff? Like, what else have we got then? What else is there?

Jenna Goodwin: 41:51

We talk about the monks and the alleys. Monks. What were they The Cistercian monks and places like that. So Houghton Abbey, where I grew up, Abbey Houlton. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 42:00

The Abbey at Houlton.

James Routledge: 42:02

Okay. That starts to make a bit more sense. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 42:04

Okay. So there is actually still an Abbey there. The ruins are there. Okay. It was covered up by a farm and then covered up by a school, and then they did, like, a huge excavation in the seventies.

Jenna Goodwin: 42:14

But they used to make tiles. They're made in caustic tiles, which is basically where you cut little shapes out, make colored tiles, and then they dry. And And the whole of the floor they found it in the Potteries Museum, if you wanna go up and have a look at what they found at Halton Abbey. I mean, that was, what, the 13, 1400?

James Routledge: 42:32

Wow. So they were making tiles in the 13, 1400 Yeah. Here. Yeah. Monks were.

Jenna Goodwin: 42:39

Yeah. Yeah.

James Routledge: 42:39

What kind of monks are we talking? Oh, I think Just just When I think monk, I just think Buddhist monk. But

Jenna Goodwin: 42:44

No. Just like a just like a normal monk. Just like how you would imagine a monk.

James Routledge: 42:47

Okay. Like like a priest.

Jenna Goodwin: 42:49

Yeah. Pretty much. But monks that lived in albies weren't all priests.

James Routledge: 42:53

Okay.

Jenna Goodwin: 42:53

They just imagine a nun Yes. But a man.

James Routledge: 42:56

A nun, yeah, a nun but a man making tiles in albey hulton.

Jenna Goodwin: 43:00

But they also grew beer. They Wow. Had fishing ponds. They had thousands of sheep for wool.

James Routledge: 43:08

Wow. History's important, isn't it? I mean, I'm preaching to the choir, but it really is because I feel like it it helps to connect. It is inspiring in in some way, and it makes you feel especially if you've got, like, a lineage here in some way. Or Or even if not, even if you're just in the area and, like, you see these visuals around you, it does if certainly in me, it does, like, evoke something of, like, oh, you know, I can do that too.

Jenna Goodwin: 43:32

Or Yes. I think that's so important. Does it I think in order to know where you're going, you should know where you've come from. You can't learn from things if you don't know them. Mhmm.

Jenna Goodwin: 43:46

And I also think it gives you that sense of ownership again.

James Routledge: 43:48

Yeah. It gives you the pride. It definitely gives you some sort of pride. On honestly, on a very basic level, it gives you something to talk about. Yeah.

James Routledge: 43:54

Like, if you meet someone, you can say, oh, you know, yeah. Did you know this about the place I'm from? Or, you know, this place I grew up was was, you know, was this thing. Like, it gives you it gives you some sort

Jenna Goodwin: 44:06

of I've never really known an area that is so interested in its own history. I mean, you go to, like, London and Birmingham, places like that, and, yes, the big famous places are interesting. And you go to London, and you get guides that take tourists around. But the people that live there don't seem to have the same weird civic pride that we have in Stoke over our history.

James Routledge: 44:26

I I think it all comes from pride. I think even all the negativity and all the, you know, the some of the hate, I think it all comes from love. Like, there's so much love and pride here that I feel like often it's unexpressed. And maybe, you know, I think people need to get making again. I think people need to get creative again because I think it's one, it might lead to some new businesses or whatever, but also it's just it's healing.

James Routledge: 44:55

And I feel like there's a lot of healing and, just this process that that we all need to go through, to sort of refine this new chapter. And I think creativity is a great outlet to do that. I think people actually, yeah, need to get tinkering and get playing. And so I think that will help us rewrite this

Jenna Goodwin: 45:14

And people don't need to make things to sell. No. That's a sad thing. Thing that we have in this, like, weird capitalist society that we live in at the moment.

James Routledge: 45:21

Just play.

Jenna Goodwin: 45:21

Just go home and pick up a pen and a piece of paper and just draw something. Is it crap? Probably.

James Routledge: 45:26

Yeah. Just sign on

Jenna Goodwin: 45:27

Does it matter? Throw it in the bin.

James Routledge: 45:28

Go to Wedgwood or Valentine's clay and throw a pot just for the fun of it. Just like I complete Get

Jenna Goodwin: 45:34

back to your roots.

James Routledge: 45:35

Yeah. Completely agree. Get into crafts. There's there's all sorts

Jenna Goodwin: 45:38

of There's so many crafts on in the city, especially for kids. Like 100%. The holidays are coming up. And I've seen so many events on where you can, like, just get your hands in the clay and

James Routledge: 45:47

draw things. Incredible that. I feel like, you know, that's been a big thing for me. I just really see in the effort that people put in into into providing the arts for people is is pretty phenomenal.

Jenna Goodwin: 45:59

And a lot of them are free. On

James Routledge: 46:01

a shoestring budget. You know? It's not like people are doing it on, like I saw, put it on the knot the other day. But, you know, Spode Museum have got these summer workshops where you can do all sorts of different stuff. Yeah.

James Routledge: 46:11

Apparently, at Wedgwood, there's just this whole area that you just can go to for free and just play with things. You know? There's I'm sure there is at many other places. So it's

Jenna Goodwin: 46:20

And I love that about Stoke. That is one of the things that you won't find in big cities. There's not a lot to do for free. Mhmm. But I don't know if it's because we're a creative area and people wanna share creativity, or if it's because it's a low income area and people want to get them in

James Routledge: 46:35

I think it's both.

Jenna Goodwin: 46:36

I do.

James Routledge: 46:37

Personally. I

Jenna Goodwin: 46:37

think it's both. It's really important. I mean, if you've got kids or if you're lonely or you have low income and you can't afford to go to the theater every night or something, there's something for you to do nearly every single day instead.

James Routledge: 46:49

And what what would you like say say someone's got, you know, that got a is it feeling a bit downbeat about Stoke or and even Staffordshire and just feeling, oh, you know, there's not much to do around here. Like, you know yeah. Just just feel, you know, it's a bit of a dump. Like, what what would you just say to them? Like, where what would you tell them to do?

James Routledge: 47:11

Where would you tell them to go?

Jenna Goodwin: 47:13

Outside. Get off the Internet. Mhmm. Walk round. Go everywhere.

Jenna Goodwin: 47:21

Pick something that you're interested in. Are you interested in walking? Then go for a walk. Do you like cycling? Cycle.

Jenna Goodwin: 47:27

Do you like birds? Go down to Westport Lake. You know? Yeah. Pick something that you're interested in, and then go

James Routledge: 47:33

Go and

Jenna Goodwin: 47:33

do it. And do it. Because you'll soon find that when you get off the Internet and into the real world of Stoke on Trent, it's nowhere near as bad as people think.

James Routledge: 47:41

Love that. Love that. And agreed. It's it's there's a online reality and an offline reality, which are very different. And sometimes

Jenna Goodwin: 47:48

do think sorry to interrupt you. But I genuinely think that's the difference between me and my opinion and a lot of other people's opinions because they are watching what I write and what what I video on the Internet. I'm there. I'm interacting with people. I'm being taken around by the owners of buildings and showing the nooks and crannies.

Jenna Goodwin: 48:06

And I'm doing the research, and I'm there all day in the lovely sunshine or the rain or and I'm listening to the birds sing, and I'm learning the stories of the stones and all that sort of stuff. And then you also forget that when I'm filming at these places, I need to eat. I need to go to the toilet. I need to go and buy a pencil or something like that. So I'm going into these local shops, and I'm going into and I interact with everything around these areas that I'm going to video and are talking about.

Jenna Goodwin: 48:34

So I am living it. I am walking through the green spaces, and I do that every single day, and I love that. And a lot of people don't. No. You're an agent.

Jenna Goodwin: 48:44

Online. And if you don't want the negativity, go and explore.

James Routledge: 48:49

Yeah. Love it. And what what what are your top three historical sites, buildings, places to visit?

Jenna Goodwin: 49:01

Gotta say Middleport Pottery. Got to. That'd be absolutely ridiculous not to say

James Routledge: 49:07

Middleport Pottery.

Jenna Goodwin: 49:08

It's one of my favorite places in the city. And I think it's because we almost lost it, didn't we? And it's been turned into such an incredible place, and it's still a factory. They're still making pottery, and you can still go there and buy it. And they're still making pottery in a really unique way.

Jenna Goodwin: 49:27

But, also, again, there's loads of events on. So, you know, you can go and play with clay. You can go and color in. If you can go to the cafe and have something to eat, they have exhibitions on. There's businesses down there.

Jenna Goodwin: 49:38

You've got, like, the little street across the road that's got little businesses in, the, you know, the street. So that's the first one.

James Routledge: 49:46

So Middleport pottery.

Jenna Goodwin: 49:51

How far are we talking? I think Staffordshire. Stafford Castle. Stafford Castle? Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 49:57

I was there a couple of what? I was there a couple of days filming ago filming because I'm working with Historic Stafford to make, like, a little mini video about it. Wow. It's got to be one of the most important castles in the UK. Wow.

Jenna Goodwin: 50:13

It's so unique because the keep on the top is relatively modern, but all of the earthworks are there. And this it's not open all week. The castle's open to the public. You can go and walk your dog. And there's, like, there's really good trails all the way around with signs that tell you exactly what was there and what happened all the way through.

Jenna Goodwin: 50:36

But we nearly lost it. It was nearly demolished in the seventies. There was a huge one of the hugest archaeological excavations. There's a really good documentary about it on YouTube if if anybody wants to watch it. But it's completely free.

Jenna Goodwin: 50:49

Like, you can go, take the kids, take a picnic, go sit on the grass, go explore the keep, go in the visitor's center, buy a lolly. You know, it's lovely. You can go up and walk the dog. They have really awesome things on there. They have, like, a theater.

Jenna Goodwin: 51:03

The gatehouse theater sometimes put things on there. There are fireworks and events. It's just awesome. But then, like, you can go on a weekday morning, and it's really quiet, and you could just sit and draw or take your laptop and work. And it's, you know, being next to them places, and it's quiet.

Jenna Goodwin: 51:20

And it's not dead quiet because it's near the Amsex, but it's reasonably quiet. I think it's just lucky that we've got these sort of spaces. Yeah. Yeah. So the place?

Jenna Goodwin: 51:33

3rd. There's so many, aren't there?

James Routledge: 51:41

To you. Yeah. It's really hard to design.

Jenna Goodwin: 51:47

See, I I I would say all the pottery factories that we've still got, but I'm trying to think of something different. Leaktown Centre.

James Routledge: 52:01

This is a day out?

Jenna Goodwin: 52:02

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I love Leek.

James Routledge: 52:04

Really? Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 52:05

I love Leek. Leek should be a blueprint for what we want our times to be like. And you

James Routledge: 52:09

think that's got, like, a historic significance as well, or you just It's just

Jenna Goodwin: 52:12

just old, ain't it? It's it's a really good mixture of old and new. It's got thriving shops, thriving high street, loads of foodie places Yeah. Loads of bars and independent places you can go for a drink mixed with old museums, library. And then 2 minutes outside of Leek, you've got the Peak District.

James Routledge: 52:31

Yeah. And you'd like other towns to sort of

Jenna Goodwin: 52:33

Embrace that. Yeah.

James Routledge: 52:34

Embrace. Yeah. Leek's got that.

Jenna Goodwin: 52:35

The towns need to be the towns and the city needs to be the city, but the towns need to look after need to be more town y. If you know what I mean.

James Routledge: 52:44

Nice. And then final final few questions. Favorite place to get coffee?

Jenna Goodwin: 52:50

Honestly, if they serve iced coffee at the moment, anywhere. I am absolutely obsessed with iced coffee.

James Routledge: 52:56

Where would you choose to go, though? Across Staffordshire.

Jenna Goodwin: 53:00

Right. You go you're gonna hate me for this. I'm not. You are?

James Routledge: 53:03

I won't.

Jenna Goodwin: 53:03

You will. Starbucks. No way. Do you want me to tell you why?

James Routledge: 53:08

No. I don't even wanna know.

Jenna Goodwin: 53:09

No. No. You need to know. You need to know the answer because I told you you wouldn't like it. I don't even wanna know.

Jenna Goodwin: 53:12

I can only one time a year. Yeah. Pumpkin spice latte.

James Routledge: 53:15

Alright. That's fair enough. Independent.

Jenna Goodwin: 53:18

Independent. I'd probably say bear.

James Routledge: 53:26

Beer. Beer. People love beer, honestly.

Jenna Goodwin: 53:29

I know, but it's really nice coffee.

James Routledge: 53:30

The food I mean, the coffee's great. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 53:32

I had a I went for a full English breakfast, and, like, I'm happy with a greasy fry up. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. But it was absolutely Yeah.

James Routledge: 53:38

What about food then? Where would you go for food?

Jenna Goodwin: 53:41

Food?

James Routledge: 53:43

Where's your favorite place?

Jenna Goodwin: 53:51

There's a fisheries in Cheadle, and I can't even remember what it's called. But if you live in Cheadle, everybody will know what I'm on about. It's a fisheries, and they do full English breakfast. That's pretty much all they sell is breakfast food. Yeah.

Jenna Goodwin: 54:03

It's like a log cabin by the lake.

James Routledge: 54:05

Oh, wow.

Jenna Goodwin: 54:05

And they only serve breakfast food.

James Routledge: 54:08

Nice. So it's like a breakfast place,

Jenna Goodwin: 54:11

but When is it fisheries? It's called the Super

James Routledge: 54:12

Breakfast. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Wow.

James Routledge: 54:14

That's

Jenna Goodwin: 54:14

your top spot. Blake Hall.

James Routledge: 54:15

Blake Hall.

Jenna Goodwin: 54:16

Yeah. Wow. That absolutely escaped you. Blake Hall. Spot.

Jenna Goodwin: 54:19

Yeah.

James Routledge: 54:19

Love it. Love it. And then finally, just favorite thing. I mean, you might have already said it. What's your favorite thing to do around here?

Jenna Goodwin: 54:28

Just explore. Just be outside. I just think there's never nothing to do. Yeah. You can walk around and find a new shop, find something interesting, find a green space.

Jenna Goodwin: 54:37

There's so many events on. Just be here, I think.

James Routledge: 54:41

Yeah. Love it. Love it. It's been a pleasure, honestly. You're such a such a breath of fresh air, I think, here.

James Routledge: 54:46

Like, you've got, I don't think you've got a controversial opinion at all. I think you've got a really refreshing take on someone that gets out there, engages with the place, and your voice is so important. It really is. Like, I feel I know you you write a lot and you post a lot and you do you do your videos. I think even already, you're you're giving people a new insight into the area.

James Routledge: 55:06

So, yeah, please keep doing it.

Jenna Goodwin: 55:08

Oh, I definitely will.

James Routledge: 55:09

It's been a pleasure. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for listening to The Knot Pod. If you like this podcast and want more, please follow us on social media at the knotdaily, and subscribe to get good news from the knot direct to your inbox via www.the knot.news.

James Routledge: 55:27

Join the community, join the movement, and together, we're changing the narrative, and by doing that, we're gonna change the place. And please always remember, when you see something positive in our area, just think, that's one for the right. See you next time.