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Ash (magzoncam) & Ryan (espocrespo). "We were making music for LA, from Stoke"

/ 01:17:54/E7
James Routledge:

Welcome to the knot pod. I'm your host, James Routledge. And the knot is the home of good news for Stoke on Trent and Staffordshire. We're on a mission to change the narrative about where we live. And that's why every day, we share with you positive stories, events, things to do, and journalism that all shine a light on what's great about this place we call home.

James Routledge:

You can find us online at www.thenot dot news, where you can sign up by email to get curated, no ads, no clickbait news direct to your inbox. On this podcast, we're interviewing inspirational creatives, entrepreneurs, and leaders from across Stoke and Staffordshire. Episodes are out every other Wednesday. And you can watch the entire thing on YouTube too. Before we get into it, I'd like to thank our partners, Dissident Creative Agency and Stone, for recording and producing this podcast.

James Routledge:

Duchess China, for providing the great tea sets. And Wandering Bee for providing the candles. I hope you enjoy this episode and join the knot for everything great about Stoke on Trent and Staffordshire. Cool. I'm gonna ask you to tell that

Espocrespo:

story again.

James Routledge:

I just think it's

Espocrespo:

funny. Yeah.

Magzoncam:

I know. It's just funny. It's a bit wild.

Espocrespo:

I think

James Routledge:

the fact that the the wheel got stick nicked in Manchester is just funny.

Magzoncam:

I I don't know.

James Routledge:

You know? Because to most people, they're like, yeah. You're leaving you're leaving Stoke and, you know. Yeah. Yeah.

James Routledge:

Yeah. That just sums up how, like, actually big cities are way are way worse crime wise and stuff.

Magzoncam:

I scratched my head. I was like, why wouldn't you try and take the bike? Why why just the wheel?

Espocrespo:

That's what I said.

James Routledge:

To you. Well, the wheel's easier to nick, isn't it? Your bike was chained up, I guess.

Magzoncam:

Yeah. Yeah.

Espocrespo:

So what you can what you can do with just that one wheel? Like, what you can do with it?

James Routledge:

And to be fair, in London, I don't know anyone who didn't either get knocked off or get their bike nicked. Like, I got knocked off my bike in London. It's just yeah.

Magzoncam:

See, I I cycle I love cycling in London as well, but it's a that's a thing I wanted, for Stoke to do is, like, why isn't the like, you know, at the Boris bikes or something like that?

James Routledge:

Yeah. Layton. Yeah. You could and there's great cycling in and around Stoke and Staffordshire.

Magzoncam:

We've got the canals.

James Routledge:

Yeah. It is good. It is good.

Magzoncam:

Why can't I rent a little electric bike on the side or something?

James Routledge:

I see people cycling around a lot though, to be fair.

Magzoncam:

There are there are

James Routledge:

People have got their own e bikes. I mean, they're they're always nailing it down the canal.

Magzoncam:

I just feel like for tourism, if I Yeah.

Espocrespo:

Yeah.

Magzoncam:

It's come up for some reason and I can do

James Routledge:

You can jump on 1.

Magzoncam:

Even like for pottery? Yeah.

Espocrespo:

Yeah. Yeah.

James Routledge:

Looking out On a buy on a buy. Yes. Good idea

Espocrespo:

that. Summer.

James Routledge:

Good idea. I just

Magzoncam:

don't know why the council hasn't You know what I mean?

Espocrespo:

Got no money at all in car parks.

James Routledge:

The amount of people that expects the council to do everything around here though, I've never seen anything like it. It blows my mind. People literally think the council

Magzoncam:

Oh, responsible.

James Routledge:

Like the king and queen of Stoke and must serve their cons their people. And I just never seen anything like it. It's the most backwards mentality I've ever come across in my life. I've never called it backward before,

Espocrespo:

so I

James Routledge:

don't know if we're recording because it really does annoy me.

Magzoncam:

It's, yeah.

James Routledge:

I was on the streets the other day in Hanley doing a thing, and, like, this lady starts shouting the council. And I let I'm definitely not gonna get into an argument with what I think was a drunk woman in hand. But I just wanted to say, every every building here is owned by a private private private. Every single building is owned by an investor or a business person. It's it's there.

James Routledge:

The onus is on them to

Espocrespo:

create Yeah.

James Routledge:

People. I'm not saying the council didn't do anything.

Espocrespo:

But

Magzoncam:

I don't think people have the education. No. People don't have the the levels of what stuff is and how it works. So if any type of problem pops up, it's like

James Routledge:

The council. It's easy to blame, isn't it? And I feel like it goes a bit deeper than that. I think it's about, like, your agency and how you maybe your confidence and how much you think you're in charge of your life.

Magzoncam:

Yep.

James Routledge:

I think it goes back to, like, the whole factory owner, factory worker. I feel like people in this this area has come from, you know, that background where people are basically expected to just turn up to work and be told what to do and give

Espocrespo:

them money and then leave.

Magzoncam:

We've always had a, like, a yeah. You you're right. We've always had like, there's a safety there's a safety in, like, just like big big business, work for them, da da da da. And then when that broke down, it's like

Espocrespo:

What do we do?

James Routledge:

Yeah. What do we do? And and and it's someone else's fault now. Yeah. Which I I completely get.

James Routledge:

I'm not I'm not criticizing it.

Espocrespo:

Are we

James Routledge:

rolling, by the way? Yeah. Yeah. Oh, we're rolling? Oh, I'm gonna pull a c.

Espocrespo:

That's what

James Routledge:

we're waiting to do, mate. We're waiting for a c. So we've got this is Radiohead made by Duchess China in Stoke, Fine Bone China. That's nice. So they still produce.

James Routledge:

They're one of the only ones that, like hey. Look at that. Perfect. That's an absolute banger, isn't it?

Magzoncam:

That's nice.

James Routledge:

Yeah. They're one of the one of the few brands that properly make it. Like, I've just been to Pick It Awesome. It's got Nice.

Magzoncam:

You know,

James Routledge:

they've got people in their factory, like

Magzoncam:

Whereabouts are they based?

James Routledge:

This one, I picked this up from it's on, an industrial estate in Trentham Nice. Newstead. And, yeah. And they do loads of collaborations. So this is a Radiohead.

James Routledge:

I mean, the the imagery on that is so cool, innit? Yeah. Not the design.

Espocrespo:

Never even knew that was a thing.

James Routledge:

Now I know. I know. Hidden gem. Hidden gem. Oh, oh, careful.

Magzoncam:

Oh, yeah.

James Routledge:

Yeah. And they do, the speaker in the House of Commons has a duchess China set or something every year. So they do parliament and whatever. It's crazy. It's crazy.

James Routledge:

Yeah. It's very cool. I love unearthing

Espocrespo:

Little gems.

James Routledge:

The little gems here. I feel like there's so many.

Magzoncam:

No. There there definitely is something that we we say that's, like, there should be more product that comes out of

James Routledge:

You wanna buy more?

Magzoncam:

Yeah. More more.

James Routledge:

Do you buy would you actually buy pottery, though? Yeah. Would you?

Magzoncam:

I was in, Spode the other day, looking at a gallery. Peter Lima, photographer. And then went, like, it leads on into the, like, the gift shop or the store there. And just to see the the designs, the Yeah. Yeah.

Magzoncam:

The actual the the the the skill that goes into it, even like in this, the illustration, everything. Yeah.

James Routledge:

It's artistic, and it Yeah.

Espocrespo:

Yeah. Artistic. Definitely buy it. I think it's I think it's more since since I've got a house. I think when you start buying a house, that's when you start being more interested in Yeah.

Espocrespo:

And that kind of stuff. So I got the Palace Wedgwood collaboration. And, like, that was just but we were saying before we come on with about what it what does it take a big collaboration to make you interested in it? But I think I I don't think that's necessarily the case because I think if it was Wedgwood and it was the right thing Yeah. Because it's supporting something local, then it doesn't necessarily have to be that.

Espocrespo:

But it just opened the door to think that the the craftsmanship and the intricacy and the the detail is just it's this amazing product. But if you don't know it's there or you don't go actively looking for it, would you

Magzoncam:

would you

Espocrespo:

would you miss out on it?

Magzoncam:

There's so there's so much as well now that's, like, you can get you can get overlooked.

James Routledge:

Yeah. If

Magzoncam:

you if you don't like, for us, I think, like, you were saying something, one of your networking meetings is, like, putting pride back into Stoke.

James Routledge:

Mhmm.

Magzoncam:

That really, resonated with me. But then all of these type of, like, Wedgewood products, if they did a collaboration, because you've got because you've so because I'm from Stoke and Wedgwood is part of Stoke, then, yeah, I would I'd look more into it rather than

James Routledge:

it, aren't you?

Magzoncam:

Yeah. Yeah. Rather than, like, say, I've seen an advert of something, and it's, like, nice. So I'm like, oh, okay. That looks nice.

Magzoncam:

I feel like there's more of a connection point Yeah. With with, like, stuff from the city. I'd rather even if it costs 10, £20 more, I'd probably You

James Routledge:

go in yeah. You go into it. I love the collabs though because I think it I like the idea of stoke makers partnering with big brands.

Magzoncam:

Yeah. Like

James Routledge:

Birtley, that that little vase up there, that's Birtley. That's made in Middleport, Pottery. And they've got a collab with, like, Ralph Lauren,

Espocrespo:

which is just,

James Routledge:

you know, Ralph Lauren, huge brand. We all know, like, we all know Ralph Lauren. And to think they're partnering with a brand in Stoke to create something amazing is is what he is. Yeah. And it's feel like the more I go go into the ceramics I feel like the story is the ceramics industry's dead.

James Routledge:

That's kind of the narrative I've grown up with at least.

Magzoncam:

That is yeah. That's what's

Espocrespo:

And it's not true?

James Routledge:

No. It's actually not true. It's it's just not what it was. It's different, basically.

Magzoncam:

Yeah. Well, we've got we've got still a few of those.

James Routledge:

There's loads. Yeah. It's just not, like, back in the day, it was whatever that none of us I don't think any of us would have been alive for.

Espocrespo:

But

Magzoncam:

I feel like as well in Stoke, we're very, or Staffordshire should I say, we're very, we don't think in cycles. So, like, I was watching something the other day about, like, the top ten restaurants in the world, and they're they don't last for years years years. It's they come for a season. A chef comes for a season, makes something amazing. And if you don't if you're not attending it or going to it, then it's gone, and you've missed that chance.

Magzoncam:

Whereas I feel like here, we're very much like, it needs to last for 10 years.

James Routledge:

Yeah. We're a bit stuck in the past. Yeah.

Magzoncam:

Yeah. So we need I feel like as a as a community, we need to go out support. And then, like, if it has its cycle and goes, then it goes.

James Routledge:

It's okay.

Magzoncam:

Yeah. That's okay. It it it gives birth to something else. It might inspire somebody else to make something. And then 100%.

James Routledge:

100%. And where did you both grow up here then?

Espocrespo:

Me? Well, Bloorton Trenton Way.

James Routledge:

So

Espocrespo:

Yeah. I was born in Bloorton. Grew up in Bloorton, but I went to school in Trenton. So combination between the 2, and I've lived there my whole life. So bit of bit of Trenton, bit of Bloorton, depending on So you've

James Routledge:

stayed you've stayed rooted. Yeah?

Espocrespo:

Yeah. What about you?

Magzoncam:

I like to call myself a Stoked Gypsy because, I was born in Shelton, moved to Fenton. Yeah. And then I think I've lived in the 6 towns every

Espocrespo:

every town. You've been all over the town.

Magzoncam:

Lived in Stafford for a bit. Yeah. Kinda can't keep still Yeah. Around the city.

Espocrespo:

I love it.

James Routledge:

I love it. And I should have asked you this at the start, but I've been calling you both by your Instagram handles. I've been calling you Mags on cam Yeah. And I've been calling you Espocresto. How would you like do you like to go buy Mags?

Magzoncam:

It's mad most people like, if it's not family, I'm Mags. Yeah. And if it's family or close friends, really close. And I'm Ash, but everybody does know me.

James Routledge:

I think you're I think you're Mags today then. What about you?

Espocrespo:

I'll say well, you can call me Espo Cresswell if you want, or Espo Ryan. Yeah. What whatever's easier.

James Routledge:

Because I remember fact, when I was when I moved back to Stoke, I think every person I've had on this podcast was part of me finding things in Stoke, because I feel I moved back. And, yeah, just naturally, I was I was trying to find something, whether it's things to do or people to connect with, things to be inspired by. And I can't remember how, but I remember finding you on Instagram, Espocrespo on Instagram. And I was I remember, does it have stoke in your bio or something? Yeah.

James Routledge:

Yeah. Does it? Like, made in stoke or something

Espocrespo:

like that?

James Routledge:

Yeah. Yeah. And I remember thinking, wait. This is like a fashion like a fashion influencer here. He was doing photos at Trenton Gardens.

James Routledge:

Obviously, I could tell I could I know that I could tell the backdrops. And then from there, I must have found you, and I'm seeing you doing, like, music videos. And And then from there, I'm I'm like, there's this other world

Magzoncam:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

James Routledge:

I feel like but I had to find I've I had to dig pretty deep Deep

Magzoncam:

to find out. Find out.

James Routledge:

I remember when I first even found out about, like, the

Magzoncam:

slam witch club. Never even

James Routledge:

I didn't even know that existed. And then I found that there was the backyard. Yeah. And then I found that there were events in the backyard. So I'm, like, messaging Nicole and Steph.

James Routledge:

I'm like, this is a bit weird. But but I I found that that's how deep I had to go It is. It's to find Yeah. People and things.

Magzoncam:

It's, we're quite, I would say we're quite we're just I think, like, each person's living their movie, and then they just do their thing in that sort of main character movie role. And we don't that's why I think, like, The Knot and what you do is essential, because it lifts the profile of what we're we're all trying to work and do what we're doing, but we haven't had something that kind of connects the bridge, that kind of, like, showcases the talent that we have. I feel like we're all trying to work, strive to get to where we are.

Espocrespo:

It's the the one for the opportunity, isn't it? Like, we've said it before that there's a lot of a lot of talented people in the city, a lot of people doing good things, but I think people lose lose hope or, like, if it doesn't happen quick and nothing happens quick, like, success, unless you're very lucky, doesn't happen overnight. So I think a lot of people, if that success doesn't materialize They

Magzoncam:

kinda shut. Yeah. They shut off.

Espocrespo:

Just shut off, and then that the the connections fall away, and people stop stop doing the things that they're they're passionate about. But I think that's something that we've, like we were just saying that we've been doing this, like

Magzoncam:

10 years.

Espocrespo:

To 10 years doing different different things about being creative and just doing the things we like doing. And, I think that one of the things we've we connected on is is putting people from Stoke on and helping people from Stoke and trying to trying to make that a thing, because I always felt that when we did music, like, 10 years ago or maybe that people were a bit like, if you got a slight bit of success or you did something good, people are always a bit like and pulled the face a bit of, like I don't know whether it's like a a small small city, small town mentality of that, like, oh, why are they doing something different? Or if you get a little bit of success, why why aren't we involved? Yeah. Or why you know?

Espocrespo:

And there's there's plenty of opportunities, but there's you've you've gotta you've gotta want to, and you've gotta put the work in to make the opportunities happen, I feel.

Magzoncam:

Do you know where I think I think that comes from, we've got a survivalist mentality. There's a lot of people in Stoke that are creating and not having the either the funds behind them Mhmm. Or Platform. The platform. Well, there's there's there's other things, but I feel like we're in a survivalist mentality of where it's like, I can't share my idea with or I can't do this or, like and it's it's a lot of fighting.

James Routledge:

Where do you notice that? Like, because your background's been in music. Would you see that in in everything creatively? Yeah.

Magzoncam:

Everything creatively. Everyone is, like, fighting tooth and nail for space that we don't really need to. It's it's kinda it's because I look at it as as as a, money sort of situation. If there was more money in the city, for creatives to create, then I feel like a lot of people would be would relax a lot more.

Espocrespo:

Mhmm.

Magzoncam:

But because there's not that flow and people feel like

James Routledge:

It's like people are a bit stressed. Like

Magzoncam:

Yeah. Yeah. Tired.

James Routledge:

I don't know if I'm gonna get enough for myself. I need to

Espocrespo:

keep things in. You're taking my

Magzoncam:

Yes. Potentials. So collaborations shut down because I've I've, like, I've come around to thinking that, like, okay, cool. I can be one voice. But if I bring Ryan on, that's 2 voices.

Magzoncam:

We're allowed and

Espocrespo:

We're working together.

Magzoncam:

And if I do that with more people with a good idea, it just helps. It just makes it but I feel like the mentality in Stoker's, I've got this great idea, and

Espocrespo:

I can't Yeah.

Magzoncam:

I can't I need to

James Routledge:

Let's call it though as well. I think we're all I mean, I'm 33. I don't know how old you are. 30.

Magzoncam:

Same age.

James Routledge:

Okay. So we're sim similar age. Let from my perspective, even though the roots of this region are incredibly creative Mhmm. Staffordshire is called the Creative County, which is actually at the moment, unfortunately, ironic. If we're if we're really if we're really honest, there are places in this country that are much more creative currently or outwardly creative than than Staffordshire.

James Routledge:

I don't I didn't feel like I could express my creative side growing up. I didn't even feel like I could explore it. You know? I suppose the school I went to was quite academic anyway. I think that they it was very much like, you know, get your a's and your b's and your c's in math and science.

James Routledge:

But in general, I remember I'll I'll take it into fashion. I actually remember going out on nights out and feeling like I didn't really wanna wear anything too loud or too out there.

Espocrespo:

100%. Yeah. Yeah.

James Routledge:

Because I was nervous that someone would and people would've done just say something to me or look at me funny. And, you know, so it's hard. I I do think for me, at least in the nineties or the naughties, more like the naughties, it was it was hard to express myself creatively.

Espocrespo:

I think that's that's definitely the thing. It's definitely I I mean, I I fully echo that, but I think it took I think, well, we probably all grew up in a similar age where we went from Instagram, Facebook not being a thing to all of a sudden it be become anything. Mhmm. And I think that's when that kinda, for me, fell into a path where that changed because you've gone from school where you don't really know anything other than the environment you're in, so you just do what everyone else at school is doing because that's all you know. And it's probably music going from 16 to 18 ish going through college school and college, where college and the music I was into sort of started influencing what I liked.

Espocrespo:

So you'd watch music videos. You see, for me, it was like Lil Wayne, Kanye, Drake, the you look at the music videos and you're like, I like that. I kinda wanna be like that. But that stuff wasn't definitely wasn't around.

Magzoncam:

Well, we're in a we're in a a vacuum. So I feel like Stoke is 5 years behind the trend. So if London something is happening, it's only gonna spread to here.

James Routledge:

It's like the grime scene's kicking off in London. It's like

Magzoncam:

It's not it's not ending.

James Routledge:

5, 10 years until it gets here. Yeah.

Magzoncam:

And that's what happened. But but for me, I've been the odd one out from dot from dot for odd one, and I've tried to fit in. I've tried to, like, oh, it's, Rockports and Oasis. Okay. And and tried to get into the culture of what's normal around, like, everybody else and then figuring out that, like, it's fine to be different.

Magzoncam:

Like, I've inverted the different way. Like, okay. It's called it's fine to be, stand alone, and you'll find other people that stand alone, and that's how I gravitate towards people. So that's definitely how I met Ryan. As he's saying, he looked at something different and and stood out.

Magzoncam:

So then I'm like, oh, okay. I've got other friends that are exactly the same that don't don't fit in. I'm kind of like a a misfit that's not kind of fit in. But then develop something that does fit in and people are like, okay. I really like that.

Magzoncam:

That's cool. And I feel like our stoke has, evolved through time. It's given a a bit more space, bit more like

James Routledge:

Well, you must feel that because you're you're both here.

Magzoncam:

Yeah.

James Routledge:

You know? Again, to call it, a lot of people feel like they need to leave too. And it's natural to go away and and either come back or not. That's that's part of modern life now. We can all live in different places, and and that's way more accessible than it was to, like, our parents' generation.

James Routledge:

But it is though true that this area, a lot of people do leave, and particularly the talent Yeah. Leave and and don't and don't come back. And I think that's opportunities, but it's probably also culture of, you know, feeling. I speak to a lot of people. I'm speaking to a lot of young people recently.

James Routledge:

And when I hear them say that they want to leave or they're going to leave, it's not always just about career. No. Yeah. It's actually not. To be honest, I actually think it's more about what we talked about, about that feeling and feeling able to express yourself and Yeah.

James Routledge:

Be who you are. Like

Magzoncam:

You have to see yourself like, the identity of a place, you have to see yourself in it. And if you don't, you're gonna move. I moved I moved to London for 10 years, just after just before GCSEs. So it was quite a pivotal moment to move. And then how London is, like, it's amazing.

Magzoncam:

And then I've come back, due to, like, family, my granddad being ill before being ill. So coming to support the family. And it like, I've wrestled with the idea of, like, I don't fit in Stoke. I need to be in a Manchester. I need to be in a bigger space.

James Routledge:

Because you 2 look like you should live in London man you know, like, I know that's such a I almost hate that I've said that. But I think a lot of people would, you know, see a snapshot of you 2 and be like, That's not fun. Don't don't open your mouth for a second. Where do these 2 live? And I think if we did a poll, it would be like, yeah.

James Routledge:

Just from what you're wearing, how you're expressing yourself, you know, London, Manchester, maybe Birmingham, whatever.

Magzoncam:

You're not wrong. We did, I did the art jam. I DJed with, well, mentor of mine, John Cummins. And a lot of people thought we were from London. And it was just like, why why do you think that we're from London?

Magzoncam:

It's like, oh, it's just everything's cool and the the music and that.

James Routledge:

It's Just the way you are.

Magzoncam:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I was like, okay. Sort of, like, noted it, took it in.

Magzoncam:

But I feel like, one thing I'm really pushing towards now is the grass isn't always greener, somewhere else. The grass is greener where you water it. So if I don't see the image of myself in Stoke, then why am I not why am I not projecting something where I do see that? Why am I not creating something or a space or something where that does exist? Yeah.

Magzoncam:

I could I could go to Manchester and fit in, but somebody's already created that. And then I'm I'm kind of, like, fitting into their bubble sort

James Routledge:

of thing.

Espocrespo:

You're still more then you're just like an outsider Yeah. There, aren't you? Yeah. And I think I I get that a lot with, like, PR and brands that reach out and just be like, oh, do you wanna come to this? Do you wanna do this?

Espocrespo:

It's in London. And I'm like, I'm not in London. I'm like, oh, we we we thought you were. And so what you said there, it's trying to bring those opportunities here. Like, the thing with Bell Staff, as soon as we we reached out and got the opportunity to be involved with that, we thought, like, that's perfect for for what we need to really shout about in the city of there are all these good things that have come from here, and there are good things that you can contribute to to the city.

Espocrespo:

You don't have to go somewhere else. And especially now with the Internet and with, like let's go back to Instagram. It's like creating something that you like and showing that is it doesn't matter where you are. And, like, you can be proud of where you're from, represent where you're from, and you don't have to move somewhere else to Yeah. To display the things you're into and the things you like.

James Routledge:

And it's powerful that because, you know, a lot of people don't wanna leave where they're from. I remember I remember when I was I was 19 just before I went to university, and I was working at KFC. And, you know, I knew I was gonna go to uni, but that's what I was doing in my gap year. Saved a bit of money to go traveling and stuff. I remember I used to drive around, and I'd be listening to, like, Oasis Half the World Away or something like, wishing kinda wishing myself away from where I was because, yeah, I don't I don't think well, the Instagram definitely wasn't about then.

James Routledge:

And I don't know. I I just felt like, yeah, to be free or to be me or to be something else. I don't even know what at that time because I was young. I need to leave. And read this book recently, and there's this quote in it.

James Routledge:

It's actually apparently a geography quote, which is like freedom is a place. And it is I don't think what you've just said, which is really strong, I don't think a lot of younger people perhaps, or just people in general, feel empowered in that way. Feel like you can create anything from wherever you are, not just Stoke.

Espocrespo:

Yeah.

James Routledge:

A place like Stoke or a place that feels like it might have opportunities. You can if you've got a phone in your pocket and an Internet connection

Magzoncam:

You you can create

James Routledge:

that for you.

Espocrespo:

Create. And I I I don't I definitely don't think I had that. Like, definitely 16, 17, 18, like, I was really shy. I was really quiet. I still am to to an extent, but when you see results of the hard work you put in, you see connections, you see people, like, networking, like and the things we did of, like, going to LA to work on music, that was, like if you just said to me, you know, while still at school, 5 years time, you'll be going to work on music in LA, I'd have been like, what are you talking about?

Espocrespo:

And that that and that was no no help from anyone else. That was no outside. That was always a team, what we worked together to make happen. And, like, if you put your mind to it, it can happen, but, like, I had to do it and see it for myself to believe that. Like, I didn't I definitely, growing up, wouldn't have thought that that's a thing.

James Routledge:

And were you inspired by anyone in particular, to do that, or were you very much just clambering in the dark?

Espocrespo:

I I can't I can't I can't say I was inspired someone to do that specifically. I think I was inspired to work hard because that's what my my dad instilled into me. So my dad was just like, you go you work hard. Like, you whatever you do, you put a 110% into it. And, like, if it doesn't work, you can't you can't say you didn't try.

Espocrespo:

So I I think it was that that my dad had just instilled into me. And from watching him work hard, like, he's a builder. So and he tried to get me into that, but I was like, I I I I I don't get me on stage.

James Routledge:

You're building just in a different way?

Espocrespo:

In a different way. So Yeah. No bricks. No bricks. So I think it was, like, more of a mentality thing, and, a a want to, like, always put put your put your efforts in.

Espocrespo:

And at some point, you will get rewarded. And I think chase chasing quick quick rewards can it doesn't always happen. And, like, well, the work we put in didn't happen, like, in nights.

Magzoncam:

Oh, no.

Espocrespo:

It was a long time. And it was a it's I think, like, a stoic thing is very easy to give up, if you don't see it happening or you you look at someone else. And I think it's very easy to compare yourself to people in other cities and other places. Especially

Magzoncam:

now No. More than ever.

Espocrespo:

More than ever. Yeah. And be like, why isn't that happening for us? Or why isn't that happening here? And, like, everyone's situation is different.

Espocrespo:

Every city is different. You know, everyone's got you don't know what the background are. The if they fell onto money. Yeah. Do they know someone you don't know?

Espocrespo:

And I I I think that's what it was. It's just being inspired by and I think a a hard work and a working mentality is is a stoke thing, and is rooted in the city of, like, grandparents and stuff of being from industry, being from what hard work was then to what hard work is now is a very different thing.

James Routledge:

I love the word grit. People would say grit. Yes. They feel like grit. Isn't it?

Espocrespo:

It's a it's a very tough and, but what that like, with with the world that's changed and the technology that's changed, that hard work of manual labor, maybe going out very early in the morning to coming home late at night, it's a it's a different thing. Like, it's a different way of working on

James Routledge:

It's a different slog, isn't it?

Magzoncam:

Yeah. It's

Espocrespo:

a different slog. And, like like like, I've got a 9 to 5, you've got a 9 to 5, but, like, soon as that 5 finishes, I'm on till 5 till 10.

Magzoncam:

Yeah.

Espocrespo:

Like, I'm doing something else, like, every day. Like, I don't switch off. I don't know if that's just that's just maybe just a me thing is that I can't just sit and chill. But it does sound

James Routledge:

like, though, you genuinely love what you do in that 5 till 10.

Espocrespo:

A 100%. Yeah.

James Routledge:

You know? And you've got some sort of purpose for why you're doing it as well. Like, you can tell you're both you know, it's inspiring to hear that you're both passionate, not just about what you're doing, but you're also passionate about doing it here. Mhmm. And that we do you know, people need to people need to hear that.

James Routledge:

And tell us about the you you you touched on the punch line of getting to LA with the music videos. What was that what was that journey like? Well, how did that start?

Espocrespo:

So kind kind of a mad one. So, like, I I'd split up with my girlfriend at the time. I think I was 19, 20. And I thought I might go off the rails with you. Like, you know, like, what we're saying earlier about not drinking, maybe it's

James Routledge:

go drinking.

Espocrespo:

We're going out every night. Like, we're going up early. We're going out every night. But it I a couple of my mates were music producers, and, like, we just we just started chatting. And I've got an extension on my garage at my house at my mom and dad's.

Espocrespo:

And we just said, like, one day, I was like, well, John, come on. Work on some beats. Like, I'd never worked in music. I'd never, you know, didn't know anything, didn't know how to definitely can't sing, so we weren't open that can of worms. But I was like, right.

Espocrespo:

I I could see that these these 2 lads I was working with were really talented, and I was like, maybe we can make something happen. And at the time, it was I think I got a I got a bursary or a grant from uni, so we went to, what's our music shop in Hanley called?

Magzoncam:

I know. It sounds something, but it's

Espocrespo:

it's moved now.

Magzoncam:

It's moved now. No. It's moved. It's

Espocrespo:

moved. Music was it music store?

Magzoncam:

Oh, I got it. It's like a blue

Espocrespo:

Blue blue building in Hanley. Right.

James Routledge:

Okay.

Espocrespo:

Went up there, bought keyboard, mic, monitors, interface. Just, like, yeah. Let's do it. Set up a studio, and then it was just a case of let them do the creative thing because I definitely can't. And it was just start networking of, like, Twitter, Instagram, probably Twitter more than anything of, like,

Magzoncam:

just Connecting.

Espocrespo:

Just connecting, just following people, supporting people, reaching out, and just sometimes it's just I mean, you miss every shot you don't take as as cliche as it sounds. It's like a lot of the opportunities we got was just, here's a message, here's an email. 99% don't get read, you don't get a reply. But the one that does, like, we woke we we just my phone one day just started blowing up, like, and I've got millions of, like, likes, retweets. I was like, what the hell is this?

Espocrespo:

And, like, one of the beats we'd made, a singer in LA had recorded to it, put it out, hadn't told us, hadn't said anything. Way. And then, obviously, just tagged us in it. And then we were just like and he was like, by the way, I'm shooting a music video to it. And we were just like, this is crazy.

Espocrespo:

Like, this is insane. And then we started to build a following more in America than here, which, again, kinda, I think, created a little bit of an issue with some other people in the city, of a bit like, oh, you don't care about the city. You wanna go out. And it was that was never the case. It was

Magzoncam:

It's not like you hadn't like, he tried for years years years years to work with local talent in the city. That's how I came into the picture. I want and also through, like, the UK channels as well, bringing, like artists from Nottingham

Espocrespo:

Birmingham. Everywhere. Everywhere.

Magzoncam:

But Ryan's, like, doing this humbly. Like, Ryan would go out of his way, even pick up artists to bring them to Stoke, put on shows, when people weren't putting shows on. So he's he's somebody that's always given back, always gave gave the opportunity. But as we were saying before, when when when somebody is taking notice or somebody is offering to pay for your work, which was probably in America, Ally, for Ryan, that that's obviously you're gonna you're gonna go that way.

James Routledge:

Yeah. It's not.

Espocrespo:

It was yeah. And like you say, I think we did the grime night at the Sugar Mill. So we bought Frisco, boy better know Skepta's right hand man at the time, to the Sugar Mill and put on

James Routledge:

What year was that?

Magzoncam:

I was like

Espocrespo:

20 15 Yeah. Maybe. And then we had, like, Kamikaze from Leicester Yeah. Firders, Kamal from Nottingham, and Kempe, we were working with from the tie at the time from Stoke.

Magzoncam:

Local

Espocrespo:

artist. Local. So we we wanted to put, like we wanted you got obviously, I have a big artist to pull people in, but we definitely wanted to put people on in the city to say, hey. There are talented people here. But at the time, like, the the there wasn't, like, a place, and there's a lot there's there still isn't to an extent is that you've always got to reach out.

Espocrespo:

And I say the most important thing was about networking, and a lot of it is not what you know, it's who you know, and that's what it was for us at the time is that we had a a lot more doors open in America than we did here, and which it seemed mental because, like, we we could have these conversations with artists. Like, how how we produced a song, which is still unreleased, with a guy who's won a Grammy on the song Thrift Shop with Macklemore, which is just mental. But they were more receptive of, like, are there English? Like, to them, it was something different. Like, that was the thing.

Magzoncam:

It's unique. Yeah. It's a niche.

Espocrespo:

It was, like, as much as we wanted to get over there, they wanted to come here. And, like, artists in America were just like, yeah. Don't don't don't don't care about anything other than that you're English, and we wanna work with you.

James Routledge:

Do do have you found it difficult to work with people in this area? I'm I'm putting you on the spot there.

Magzoncam:

I'd I'd say yeah.

James Routledge:

Yeah. Yeah. Because that's what I'm getting.

Magzoncam:

Yeah. Just just because people have, a preconception of how stuff is gonna work, And if you don't understand the industry and the ins and outs of it, and then when you get told, that's not possible, I feel like people feel like that's, like, a rejection.

James Routledge:

Because we do need to call it out. Because, like, if this place is gonna transform or change, like, I do feel, yeah, I do feel that people need to open their eyes to especially in the creative industries. I feel like I'm imagining what I'm reading between the lines is, you know, the people that you might have been connecting with from LA, I can just imagine that that connection just felt easier.

Espocrespo:

A 100%. Yeah.

James Routledge:

Yeah. There's more ideas. There's maybe it's maybe a bit less transactional. It's just like,

Espocrespo:

let's just All chasing a dream Yeah. Which is what I mean, that's a big LA cliche, but it is a thing that everyone out there is kinda on the same thing of, like, LA is the place where he go to, like, I wanna make it as an actor. I wanna make it as an artist. I wanna make it as an show. Big,

James Routledge:

and we're just gonna work on that

Espocrespo:

And that's where we're

James Routledge:

all somehow together to get there. And we're all in the same boat. And, actually, none of us are maybe making any money this right now. Correct. Yeah.

James Routledge:

We're all just because I've I certainly what I've noticed is the last business I built was in London. So I built a business called Sanctus, which was a mental health brand, basically. And there was this whole movement of let's talk about mental health in a different way. And what I've noticed in London, because I'm now building something here, and I'm I'm noticing a difference. I just feel like people had a bit more to give.

James Routledge:

Like, I think people, you know and dating around, I've had loads of support on the knot, and people have been incredibly people are incredibly incredibly supportive. But the truth is people don't have as much to give. Like, people in London had made on on the whole more time, more resource, more of a desire to just kinda give into something, almost invest into something, whether that's a brand or a creative project, kinda just not really not really know where it's gonna get to. And, you know, I feel like because there is less or a perceived there's perceived less here like what you were on about before about people kinda maybe being a bit more protective. Yeah.

James Routledge:

I I do find and then in creative like, literally to create art, whether it's music or fashion or you need to just let go of the outcome in a way and just be like, yeah. You're cool. I'll come around to your studio tomorrow, and let's just see what happens.

Espocrespo:

I I think that's a lot of it is shooting yourself in the foot of, like, that transactional attitude of, like, I don't I don't know. Because I've seen it in everything of, like, people will be like, we've got, oh, do you wanna come to the studio to work? And they'd be like, well, how how much are you willing to pay? And it's like, what? Like Yeah.

Espocrespo:

We're we're which I'm trying to collaborate and work with you together here. Like, what, and then because I and I think a lot of a lot of the the issues with creative stuff in general is that the money isn't there straight away. No. And it's definitely a long term thing.

James Routledge:

That's You're building equity. You're not you're not It's an

Espocrespo:

it's a creative idea, whether that's music or fashion or art, is that the money is a long term thing, and, like, you there's a lot of doors that get shut, and I felt like that with with music is, like, look, I'm not making any money off this at the time. Like, we were making a little bit from studio time, from mixing, from engineering, the odd artist paying for beats, but in the music industry, it's a very competitive space, and it's the rich are very rich. The big labels are the ones with the money and the power a lot more then than it is now. Like, it's changed a little bit. But, like, when you're asking me to pay you for a feature of a £1,000, I'm like, well, no.

Espocrespo:

Because, like, where where is that Where

Magzoncam:

is the Where are you gonna make a debt back?

Espocrespo:

Yeah. But, well, I'm not gonna make a £1,000 off anything we do together. Let's make that clear, like, at the very at the point we were at. And then that door then is shut, and I I feel like a lot of artists were like right. When we we were asking to say, hey.

Espocrespo:

Let's work on something together. Like, right now, it it might not be a thing, but until we make something, create something, put it out, Let's see what the response is like. Let's see if this could be a thing, and the money comes long term. But maybe like you say of a stoke thing, if there isn't a lot to go around and there isn't a lot of money on the table, people don't have the want to give what they perceive as the the money away like capitalist mentality. Yeah.

Magzoncam:

If you need money to create, that's that's the You do.

James Routledge:

It's a privilege,

Magzoncam:

isn't it? Yeah. Yeah.

James Routledge:

Yeah. Yeah. To have time to be able to write or paint or 100%. Music.

Magzoncam:

So when when those resources are slimmed down and you could be the greatest artist in the world, but if you if you if you don't have the money to No.

James Routledge:

You're working in the warehouse all day or then you're knackered or whatever. Yeah. Is is You don't have the space. You don't

Espocrespo:

have the laptop.

James Routledge:

You don't yeah.

Magzoncam:

So I feel like that that that causes a lot of kinks between, collaboration and people. Especially if, let's say, I seem to be doing better online than somebody else and I try to collaborate with them. They're gonna look at me like, bro, you're doing in reality, though, is is it's it's it might not be that. It's just how it how it looks. Yeah.

Magzoncam:

How, the the how we how we gain the opportunities, how that comes through. Yeah. It can be perceived in lots of ways, but we're all on the journey to get to

Espocrespo:

A a similar outcome.

James Routledge:

Yes. Some sort of form

Espocrespo:

of success. Or Yeah.

James Routledge:

Yeah. And what what do you what do you think is the biggest issue? Is it the practical of money, time, resource? You know, Ben Francis, who's the founder of Gymshark talks about, having access to, like, Premiere Pro at college or something. And, like, learning Premiere Pro and then being able to create designs and create video is like a huge benefit.

James Routledge:

So is it the practical, or is it the more, let's say, cultural and, you know, the feeling, like, you can create? Because, again, there's also a confidence. Huge takes a lot of confidence. Took me years to be able to post something online and not really care what people think

Magzoncam:

Yeah.

James Routledge:

Or to write something or to put a brand out there that I've made and just think, yeah, whatever. Like, that takes a long time. So what, is it are they both the same, or which one would you

Espocrespo:

I I think it's a bit of both, but I think, like, I was very fortunate to be, at the time, at uni working full time as well. Like, I didn't really go to uni. I just did the assignments, submitted them, and worked full

Magzoncam:

time. Yeah. I've

Espocrespo:

been work full time, but and I was very fortunate to have, like, my mom and dad's support, of, like, a place to live, Like but I I specifically chose to not move away to uni because I wanted to work, at the same time. So, like, it was a combination of that, and I was very fortunate that my mom and dad had the space on the extension where they were just like, yeah. You wanna go for it? Go for it.

Magzoncam:

Given the freedom as well.

Espocrespo:

Given the freedom as that they were like, well, we'd rather you be in here doing that than going out uptown, getting smashed. And, like,

Magzoncam:

Wait. You you gotta give props to your parents because from a parent's point of view, we would, like, we would turn off. There'd be gangs of us turning off to this, like, the garage. I can imagine, like, if you keep going, like, why is that?

Espocrespo:

Few colorful

Magzoncam:

characters. Yeah.

James Routledge:

Where are the 16 guys?

Magzoncam:

Like, one's wearing above the carpet. What's going on? Like,

Espocrespo:

but Like, yeah. So it's it's

James Routledge:

like Like mopeds

Magzoncam:

and stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Espocrespo:

But, like, I think, like, it took it it did take a lot of convincing. But then when we started showing them the, like, this is what we're making, like, we're not sitting in there, like

Magzoncam:

Just doing nothing.

Espocrespo:

Nothing. Yeah. Like, they were and we were just, like, showing, we've been working on this. We're making this. Or, like, we've been showing them a music video, and, like, we made the song for that.

Espocrespo:

And they're, like, they didn't get it at first. Like, it took a while. And then they were, like, you can keep doing it. And, like, we'd again, we'd rather you be there than

Magzoncam:

Out in the streets.

Espocrespo:

Out in the streets or, like, we don't know what you're doing. So a lot of it is that as well. You gotta have some kind of support. And, like, that didn't come as well, like like, I was at uni, so I was still doing my uni stuff. I was working pretty much full time because I needed money to support this stuff.

Espocrespo:

Like, my parents obviously give me a place to live, but, like, they didn't pay for any of the stuff. Like, they were just like, if you wanna do it, like, we're not buying it. Like, you gotta buy it. And if you wanna put on events, if you wanna do all this stuff, like, go you've gotta find the money. But then, again, like, that that thing about the perception of being, can you do this stuff, I think, is a little bit cultural, and it's a little bit, like, until you surround yourself with other people that believe in the same or think the same way as you do.

Espocrespo:

Like, at school, I was definitely not like that. At school, it was a 100% try fit in. College opened my eyes a bit of, like, there's a lot of different people here. Like, people from all over the city, people with different backgrounds, people and it was like, okay. Maybe you don't have to do what everyone else is doing.

Espocrespo:

Like and then you find people who like the niche things that you like of, like like, rap music and hip hop music. I felt at school, not a lot of people like that, but then I find similar other people in the city who like that as much as I do, and then like fashion as much as I do. But, like, the clothes and the fashion I like is not necessarily what I felt like the city looked like, which is kind of what we spoke about at Belstaff, of, like, the kind of almost going back to the heritage of the city of, like, football. It's got a big football culture, so you naturally associate that with Stone Island, CP, Bluejeans, Adidas, like and there's nothing wrong with that, like but that wasn't what I felt. That's what I liked.

Espocrespo:

Yeah. Yeah. And it took a while to feel like I can express what what what I like. And part of it was, like, as mad as it sounds like, the reason I've got my other page, my blog, is I posted pictures of the clothes I liked and outfits on there because I didn't want it on my personal one, because I didn't want people being like, what the hell is that?

James Routledge:

Become your creative outlet, hasn't it? You've created your block Duvois, and then that's your separate

Espocrespo:

creative outlet.

James Routledge:

And fast forward into now, what do you what's I spoke 2 2 questions. 1st, like, where do you now where would you go now to connect with like minded people? Like, where are you finding where are you finding Mags? Where are you finding Ryan? Like, where are you obviously, your mate, so you found it.

Magzoncam:

For for me, it's

James Routledge:

And if you're not, be honest.

Magzoncam:

So, no. I don't I don't think I don't think there's a space actually right now that has the same sort of mindsets that I have. I kind of like I go through different events, different things, and I find those people. Before though, when I was younger, there used to be like, my root is I've come from, like, the youth service. The youth service is sort of the Stoke on Trent youth service has given me most of the skills I have today.

Magzoncam:

So I learned how to DJ there because I don't have 8 grand to pie Pioneer decks as a as a kid. Like, the the work that I know how to use logic, I didn't have a Mac. I couldn't buy a Mac. I couldn't afford a Mac and logic and sort of things. So without the youth services to hone these sorts of skills, I wouldn't have.

Magzoncam:

And I met all the people that I know now through either those skills or in there, And the youth services isn't about now at all. So for the kids of today, I don't know where they go and No. Create and And

James Routledge:

and just find like minded

Magzoncam:

people. Like my because even when you're younger, I feel like like high school, there's 30 of you. It's your whole class. You roll together. You might not like everybody in there, but it's you're a pack anyway.

Magzoncam:

Cool. Go you you move up college. It's a bit less. Uni, it's a bit less until you like again, you're refining you're refining your circle until it's dark. Hey.

Magzoncam:

These are the people that are my people. I don't I don't think I don't think there is a there is a space, but there's not many there's not many spaces now where we can interact. Like, nightlife isn't

James Routledge:

No. Sounds like online, to be honest, is the the best way to find and connect to people.

Espocrespo:

Because, like, if we didn't have the studio that was at mine, and then when we moved to the one at Fenton and, like, getting people come in, like, where

Magzoncam:

would we

James Routledge:

Move on. Where would we go? And then what and then for you 2 as creatives, you know, at the right at the heart of your in the body of your career, you know, one of the massive things you need, we all need anyone creative or entrepreneurial is you need a you need you need a scene of other people to make you feel like you're not alone and you belong. Mhmm. That's, like, basics.

James Routledge:

So we're saying that's kinda difficult. So that's the first one. And then what about just inspiration? Because you need and you also need to see other people again. All I keep are I remember when I I used to my last business started in Shoreditch.

James Routledge:

So every day, I'm like, graffiti, latest brand, new campaign, or new pop up shop of a new fashion company. I'm going in there and whatever. It's like there's inspiration and art all around. And I feel like those two things are key for Stoke and Staffordshire, and I'm not sure currently where creative people find them.

Espocrespo:

Yeah. I've

Magzoncam:

I've I think there's I would I'm the opposite because because I've built my tribe around so many creative people, like, you've absorbed into that now. I've met you. There's, like, there's people with positive energy that

James Routledge:

I I look for. Think you've found

Espocrespo:

that

Magzoncam:

We're not together though. So, like, me and Ryan, like, circulate each but we're not together all the time. Yeah. And there's a lot of other creative people in the city, but we're just not together. There's not like a hub where we're all at and

James Routledge:

You just follow each other on Instagram.

Magzoncam:

We we know each other on Instagram. I'll see, like, Ryan Ryan puts a post out. That's inspiring. Like, oh, cool. I've got a friend, Luke Wyatt.

Magzoncam:

He's a photographer. Kind of taught me a lot about what I know in photography. He's really creative. He put stuff out. I got another friend, Bernie, musician.

Magzoncam:

He put stuff. So there's the people that I'm around or I've grown up with, they're all that's my tribe. They're always inspiring me. Anything anything that

Espocrespo:

Well, I think, like like, what what you said, James, about trying to find the creative circle, like, we we had and I felt like I had that because it was at that age where, like, between 17 to, like, 21, you're moving in different circles of, like, going to uni, you go to college, you a lot of it was finding friends of friends of, like, I knew you probably through Ash.

Magzoncam:

Yeah. Yeah.

Espocrespo:

And then, like, they've obviously got people they know from their circles. But, like, now we're a bit older, and, obviously, you're not as close and you're not, like like, at college or, like, in school. You're a class of people. Uni, you're a class of people, like, now. Say if you you're like, you don't find your opportunity for your creative creative output till you've left university, I don't know where that space would be.

Espocrespo:

Say, we we obviously made them before that. But if we hadn't, like, if we would said we wanna start now, where where You're

James Routledge:

on Instagram. You literally have to just go on Instagram. You have to do what I've done. You have to just find the knot. You genuinely, like, find other things.

Magzoncam:

I got the one

James Routledge:

last time. Just just go on the feed, start following people, liking their stuff, commenting, DM them, try and meet them for a coffee.

Magzoncam:

Like Is that how you've like, coming back in is that how you found it? Is to be like

James Routledge:

Yeah. Because there isn't the geography of this area is completely different to, other cities. Yeah. So, you know, people spend time in in lots of different places that are quite far from each other. Some people's hangout spot might be, yeah, in a pub near their house in, like, Newcastle.

James Routledge:

Yeah. Someone else's hangout spot might be, you know, in Trenton, or someone else's hangout spot might be Hanley. Some you know, there's it is very spread. It's just the nature of of the place. And I don't think that's a bad thing so much anymore.

James Routledge:

I'm like, it is what it is. It what it's what makes the place unique. So it's not like there's a there's an IT coffee shop Yeah. I can go to where I'm not saying you're gonna bump into someone in a coffee shop and say, hey, and introduce yourself. That's well, you might go to an IT coffee shop to sit there and do some work on your laptop and just kinda feel like, you know, this is cool.

James Routledge:

Like, I'm doing this alongside other people. So I personally, yeah, do think the place is either there are lots of events happening, and there are lots of quite niche events with, like, different music, different whatever. I think going to events is a good shout for people here. Or genuinely, I think people have to be in the creative scene. I mean, probably entrepreneur really in general.

James Routledge:

I just think you have to be quite proactive. Think you gotta

Magzoncam:

be out there.

James Routledge:

Yeah. You gotta you gotta really work to find a network and probably use online to do that and probably use Instagram if if you're creative. And then just not be afraid to, like, have random meets with people. And that's probably quite a mindset shift for a lot of people. It's it's a bit of a big city thing to do.

James Routledge:

Let's just go for coffee. You know, it's not you wouldn't say that's a typically

Magzoncam:

No.

James Routledge:

A thing that's happened in Stoke over the generations. No. You know, it's not. But that's connections and community is what makes it kinda happen. Yeah.

James Routledge:

So, again, you know, I met I feel like I met you 2 properly. Not properly, but another time, there was a Belstaff event. It's a cool event. I'm gonna meet like minded people out, so I bump into you 2. But I wouldn't have been afraid of just being like, oh, shoot.

James Routledge:

Like, do you wanna just meet? Yep. I just just to share stories, listen to people's experience with no agenda. And I feel like that's what people have to do. And I I appreciate that's hard to do when you're young because I think it's quite foreign.

James Routledge:

It takes a lot of confidence to do that. We're not so used to it. And maybe there are other platforms and conveniences that we're also not

Magzoncam:

That's gonna cut. Like, I feel like if you have that, you're gonna you're going to cut through quicker anyway.

James Routledge:

You will.

Magzoncam:

It takes it takes, as you were saying, the support family or support from somewhere to push that way. But I think there's a lot I in start I feel there's a lot of bedroom geniuses.

Espocrespo:

There's a

James Routledge:

lot there's loads. I think we all know there's a lot. And I think it's actually on everyone to connect with everyone because it's it's just not gonna be given to you. And that might change. You know?

James Routledge:

There might be the good shot development in Stoke might be the the ith spot that everyone starts hanging around, but my feeling is it won't be. I'm not saying that development won't do well. No. But there's never gonna be a silver bullet. There's never gonna be a silver bullet if one venue that every creative person in Staffordshire agrees to hang out at every week or every day.

Magzoncam:

Not everyone gets on with everyone either. It's just not gonna happen. It's it's a it's a it's pockets.

Espocrespo:

And I I I feel like it's, you've gotta get the buy in from everyone to do it because, like, if I like like, for your events, like, I I know that if I've asked Magnum to come, it's gonna come. If I ask my like, Alex and the band to come, they're gonna come. But then, like, you need that sort of network of, like, okay. Well, if they're going, I'll go.

Magzoncam:

Yeah. Yeah. But, like,

Espocrespo:

if you just put on a random event and just be, like, we're doing this, until until, like, part of that circle and finding the right people of, like, spread it out until you know, like, okay, couple of mates going, might check that out. And I think that's just not just a stoke thing. That's just a thing in general that you've got you've got to try and get the buy in from enough people to get the right minds there. But whether you can find this place consistently for enough for that, I don't know. It's difficult.

Espocrespo:

And like you say, the 6 towns thing is I feel like it's a very, very probably a challenging thing because, like I know, up until I was probably 18, I probably hadn't been the other side of Amley, really. No. Realistically, I hadn't. Like And

James Routledge:

it's not even £6. It's, like, 12. Think about Stafford. And Newcastle Keelan is producing this. Keelan went to a college in Stafford with a I'm sure a load of creative people.

James Routledge:

Stafford's, like, 20 minutes away. It's the same place. Like, to me that's why for me, they're not Stoke, Staffordshire, whatever. Newcastle, Leek. They're all these creative.

James Routledge:

It's all but like you say, it's not even £6. It's like It's

Magzoncam:

massive. Yeah.

James Routledge:

It's a sprawling kinda like a sprawling region. So, yeah, you to compare it to Manchester where you can hang out at certain places or

Magzoncam:

volunteer co worker and you'll

James Routledge:

just Exactly. Or go to a certain co working space. Again, that might happen, but it definitely isn't now. So I think we're all in agreement. You've gotta find your tribe, basically.

James Routledge:

Yeah. And you gotta reach out to them. What's what's next for you 2 here? Like, what because obviously you're committed. You're both here, like and what I love about you 2 and what I'll be honest.

James Routledge:

I've been finding this hard myself a little bit is I feel like I spend a lot of time talking about Stoke and Saphish. I just feel like I wanna just create some I know I am creating something here, but realistically, you know, someone just needs to start, not just needs to. The most inspiring thing that could happen in this area is someone to just start Cole Buxton here or, you know, start create because that's re rather than talking about it

Magzoncam:

That what it is? What it is?

Espocrespo:

Then we

Magzoncam:

do it.

James Routledge:

Yeah. What we're gonna do is this huge event here or this new band's come from here. Like, you know, I love I love trying to find and follow artists that are from this region because every great city or area has their music. Yeah. They've got their voice.

Magzoncam:

Yeah. Like, they've

James Routledge:

got someone representing their voice. So

Magzoncam:

I think we've got great voices here as well, though. We we've got, like, we're both individually working with artists. I work with a couple rappers. Shot E Dogg. He's making a lot of, waves.

Magzoncam:

He's gonna come through, you're working with.

Espocrespo:

Yeah. I'm helping my cousin's band, Fawn. So I've been trying to work with them. I've been putting the marketing and, like, content and giving them a, like, a strategy of, like, taking away the the background stuff and being like, you create the music, create the product, and I'll just do all the stuff in the background that you don't wanna do.

James Routledge:

So you're both helping musicians out here, and you wanna keep doing that?

Espocrespo:

A 100%. Yeah. Like, just what we enjoy doing. Like, we I'd last no. 2 weeks ago, we did a styling with them.

Espocrespo:

So, got some stuff from Wax Clothing in London, styled them, then we went and shot it with another photographer, in Stokele Deck, and just, like, just create stuff and just

James Routledge:

Love it.

Espocrespo:

Just make some PR. And then, like, they've got an event coming up at Keele Uni. So, again, another local event. I'm gonna style them for that as well. So it's and we just wanna just wanna see them grow.

Espocrespo:

Yeah. You wanna make something. Yeah. Yeah. And I wanna see them if they can I can handle the all the stuff that they don't wanna do, and it lets them create the music and focus on that?

Espocrespo:

Like, I'm not asking for anything out of it. I'm I enjoy doing

Magzoncam:

The work.

Espocrespo:

The work and helping them. And if something comes of it, then that's that's great. Yeah. But, that's what I'm focused on at the minute. I know we've spoken about a lot at the beginning of the year about starting a brand like you say, and it's not easy.

Espocrespo:

It's a very competitive space, and I think that's what's made me hold off from doing it. It's been an idea since Closing.

Magzoncam:

Closing. Since from young.

Espocrespo:

From I wouldn't want to do it as, like, merch, like because I feel like a lot of brands start as, like, merch of, like, let's just print something on this shirt. Done.

Magzoncam:

I don't Mhmm. Yeah.

James Routledge:

I I

Espocrespo:

wouldn't want it to be like that, but it's, again, a capital thing. It's a very to do it right, it's samples. It's process. It's finding a factory. It's it's it takes time, and it takes a lot of money, and it's not always gonna work.

Espocrespo:

Like, if the first thing you make is definitely not gonna be the greatest yeah.

Magzoncam:

See, that's why me and Ryan are good because we're 2 sides of a coin where he's focused on the the materials and everything to be right. Mine is the ethos. Does it connect back to the city? Does it does it does it mean something when you wear it? Do you have pride?

Magzoncam:

Same way as if I wear Stone Island. I feel you know what I mean? I feel good. Any sort of thing that I buy and where I feel good in it. So my thing is how how how do we get that feeling of pride and and bring the city in with it?

James Routledge:

Sounds like everything you're doing, whether it's music, like the 2 artists that you're working with, and I'm sure more you know, you you wanna help them create great music and and be a great brand in how they look and how they represent. And then whatever else you might create, whether it is some sort of fashion brand or anything else that comes again, it's it's gotta connect. It's gotta be a great piece of art, like a great product that just is from here that I feel like what I get excited about when I hear that is also a lot of stuff that gets created here is I just find that it's a little bit like only selling to people here. I can't I genuinely can't see another tea towel with a kiln on no more. Like, we literally don't need any more of those.

Magzoncam:

No.

James Routledge:

They're brilliant, and they're great. And I'm sure, like, I've had them for Christmas presents for years, and they're coasters. But every you know, that's why I love this Radiohead. I look it's it's new. It's new, and it's creative.

James Routledge:

And it doesn't even have to have anything to do with Stowe. It doesn't even it could just be a completely random news. Like, it has doesn't have to have anything to do with history or heritage. Mhmm. It can do if it if it's got that

Magzoncam:

Great.

James Routledge:

If it's got that connection and that feels needed, brilliant. But it doesn't have to. And I feel like, you know, we're all so maybe passionate or proud of where we've come from that I feel like all artists here feel like they have to reference that. And you don't because we're all standing on the shoulders of that anyway. Your reason

Espocrespo:

You you represent it. Like Yeah.

James Routledge:

You you are. If you're born here or you've lived here or you've grown up here, you're here. You don't you don't always need you don't always need to put a bottle kiln in everything.

Magzoncam:

No. Yeah. Yeah. To put

James Routledge:

you don't need to put a pot bank and everything or a knot in everything or

Magzoncam:

There's a we need to there's a lot of, like, forward movement. So we we all we are tying back into heritage, but this could be reinvented. So, like, I was saying stuff to Ryan of stuff of, like, okay. Why isn't, like, let's say, Stoke City and Ballstaff haven't come together to design or I'd love to do that, but make, like, merch or something of that? Why isn't as we were saying before, like, why isn't, like, a At

Espocrespo:

Wedgewood or Yeah.

Magzoncam:

Yeah. These these The collabs. Yeah. Why isn't there more more collabs? It doesn't even, as you said, it doesn't even need to be in the city or whatever, but these are, let's say, the giants of the city.

James Routledge:

Yeah. Why aren't they? Yeah. I know you referenced the artist you all work with, E dog.

Espocrespo:

Yeah. And

James Routledge:

I think I've again, I've been on the Instagram rabbit hole. All I get from here I don't know what his music's about, but, oh, he's just from here. He's great music. It doesn't doesn't necessarily have to be about Stoker. It's just whatever that truth is, whatever that voice is for him.

James Routledge:

That's it.

Magzoncam:

He's he's more of the, like, about the grit, and he's, like he he loves Fenton for all the problems and everything that's there.

Espocrespo:

First time I first time I met him, that is the one thing that I got like, you introduced me to him. That's the one thing I got of he is proud for where where he's from.

Magzoncam:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Even with, like again, with all the problems or whatever Yeah. He's just like, I'm from Fenton, and Fenton made me.

Magzoncam:

Like And

James Routledge:

he's representing that.

Magzoncam:

Yeah. He looked right to the death.

James Routledge:

But you can represent that without kind of you don't always have to talk about it. I think that's the thing.

Magzoncam:

Yeah.

James Routledge:

You know, this the yeah. And maybe you do, and maybe that's what it's about. I just I just feel like I wanna give people here, especially young people here, permission to just create freely without feeling like they need to create, like, a t shirt with a duck on it. You know?

Magzoncam:

Yeah. No. No.

James Routledge:

Just just just be yourself. Yeah.

Espocrespo:

Just be

James Routledge:

if you're into games or whatever Japanese culture. I'm making stuff up now. But just whatever.

Magzoncam:

Look. There's enough room for everybody. Yeah. Like, I feel like we we put parameters in. I'm like, oh, no.

Magzoncam:

Like, if I don't make it about Stoke, then people might not like it or but there's an like, going through life, what I've seen is your people are out there. You'd put it out, and people will find you.

James Routledge:

LA. Yeah. There might be you know, what would again, what this area needs to grow is and what it was built on, it was built on the fact that pottery was sold everywhere Yeah. Worldwide. Worldwide.

James Routledge:

And that what that's what brought wealth and prosperity, well, wealth here in the 1st place. So this city is not gonna, you know, Bet365 and JCB and Alton Towers, who had 3 huge employees in the area. They sell a lot.

Magzoncam:

But to every yeah. Exactly.

James Routledge:

What brings in here. So I think for creators, I I do really want people to think outside of outside of this area. And, you know, their customers your customers and your fans are worldwide.

Espocrespo:

Yeah. Absolutely. A 100%. Because there's, like, there's brands that I really like, like Porter James Sport, Outer New Zealand, Alfred Apartments, or Australia, Solace, a brand from Manchester. Like, lots of really up and coming brands that do I mean, there's a lot of hard work and graph, because I know a lot of the owners of those brands that have put a lot of leg work in.

Espocrespo:

But they're doing it in, like, not not like your London, your New York. Yes. They're doing it from where they're from. It represents them, but I I like what they're doing. It resonates with me.

Espocrespo:

And I'm not from where they're from. So why why can't that be the same for you? Like And also

James Routledge:

a lot of big brands aren't aren't coming out of London at the moment. The ones that I I like Gymshark gets a load of airtime, rightly so. Solihull, Birmingham. I was thinking Hewell's another random one. I know it's completely different, but Hewell's not not London either.

Magzoncam:

Oh, there was mud.

Espocrespo:

Yeah. There's there was them represents a massive

Magzoncam:

represents huge,

James Routledge:

you know. On, again, Northwest. You know, there's a lot like a lot of big brands on coming from down south actually. Or in big cities, they're coming that these people that are rooted actually in where they're from. Like, you know what?

James Routledge:

I'm just gonna create here.

Magzoncam:

I was speaking to someone at Ballstaff, like a photographer, and, like, I didn't realize how big his profile is. And he's he's a big he's a big boy. There are

James Routledge:

a few big boys there out in his side. It was mad. There must have cumulatively been about 50,000,000 Instagram followers in that room.

Magzoncam:

Dizzy. Dizzy. Alright. But but he was saying, like, the story of London's been told, the story of these big cities have been told over and over and over. The story from your local area

James Routledge:

True.

Magzoncam:

Hasn't been told yet.

James Routledge:

So much to unearth. Yeah. So much soul to, like, to show. Agreed. It's actually it's a goal.

James Routledge:

I think it's a complete gold mine in terms of stories and art, and creativity. I completely agree.

Espocrespo:

Because it's like like, I've been to LA, and I've been to New York. And, like, before you get to those places, you kind of feel like you know those places. And it's like you've never been there, but there's so much on TV. There's so much in movies.

Magzoncam:

Everything. Yeah.

Espocrespo:

Everything. You feel like, I kinda know what's going on here already. But, like, Stoker's got enough about it. Stafford has got enough about it to to make the stories, to to tell the stories of what's going on now, what's been going on before. But it just hasn't yet.

Espocrespo:

Yeah.

James Routledge:

So the And that's the opportunity, isn't it? That's what, you know, you're at the coalface art, or I am. Others are. I feel like there is a very much a pioneering opportunity for people here to be the first that kind of claim some space here, claim some whether it's space here internally because there's definitely people internally that want more. They want more experiences, whether it's food or music or art.

James Routledge:

But, also, there's there's chance to build stuff here Yeah. That that sells beyond. Where would you in sort of 5 years' time, like, where would you where would you 2 like to be on a personal level? And then where would you like as a result, where would you like the area that you live to be?

Espocrespo:

Mhmm. Tricky one. I think for me, it'd probably be to work for myself and to help others do like, I work in marketing. So giving like, maybe do my own agency, maybe do my own thing. Like, I love where I work now, but there's always that extra freedom of when you do it for yourself, of, like, be being able to, like like you say, put all the people on around the city, give them the opportunity, or teach them the things that I've learned to, you know, to be able to give back.

Espocrespo:

But then similarly with, like, with helping with music, if I could get in with working with music, you know, maybe I could go into a music management role or, like, fashion, could be a fashion PR role. I I I don't know. There's lots of opportunities, of where it's just following what you really love doing. And if you put you put the effort in at some point, that that that right door is gonna open. And where that is in 5 years, I don't know.

Espocrespo:

But I'm hoping it's gonna be

Magzoncam:

a fruitful one. I would say 5 years. Creative director at Ryan's agency. At the moment, I'm a, school teacher. I would love to develop either my own school or develop something with the people that I'm working with now at Creative Academy.

Magzoncam:

Still being stoked, and just connect the dots. Just put more product out that's, like, from people from here who aren't here, collaborations. Just, again, just build a a network. Get Get my network even stronger so I can connect the dots for people. So, like,

Espocrespo:

I think that's a that's a good one as well, being able to connect the dots because, like, what you're good at isn't necessarily what others are. Like, is it like, for me, like, all the things that I've been able to achieve, I feel like I've been by connecting dots. Like, I would love to be able to do what you do with video, but there's no chance. Like, I just can't do it. Same with music.

Espocrespo:

I'd love to be able to make my music. Can't. It's not what I'm good at, but it's about finding those other people in the city who are have got their thing, but then it's about how can you bring these people together. Yeah. And I think that's that's what we've always tried to do, but I feel like there's always more you can do.

James Routledge:

Yeah. I hear that in both of you wanting to help raise up others and and believing that that will that will raise yourself up.

Magzoncam:

Yeah.

James Routledge:

And I love that. And, you know, it's it's definitely needed. There's I know there's there's you 2 at it in the network you've got, and there are others. And everyone collaborating and working together at some point out of their good stuff Good stuff is a 100% is a 100% gonna come. And, shifting gears slightly, they always end on the food and drink recommendations, but I might throw a couple of curveball questions in in for you.

James Routledge:

Have you 2 got a spot where you like to go out and get, let's say, tea or a coffee?

Espocrespo:

Well, touch on if it wasn't what I said before we we saw our idea to view, say if I was gonna grab a coffee, it's probably when I'm at work or grab a drink or something that's, like, coffee number 1 in in Stafford. It's pretty good.

James Routledge:

Coffee number 1 in Stafford. Nice. What were you, Max?

Magzoncam:

Mine was raw before it closed. So now, I I don't really have a space to grab a coffee, but I'd have a space where I know that I'd grab a beer from Go on. Which is the Unicorn.

James Routledge:

On Piccadilly. Nice. It's

Magzoncam:

like a little time vault.

James Routledge:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You're struggling on the coffee front, though?

Espocrespo:

Are you

James Routledge:

did you feel like it's missing in your life? Do you need it?

Espocrespo:

Or is it taken over by Costa?

Magzoncam:

No. No. No. Because I need I need something independent. When Raw was here, that was that was my spot.

Magzoncam:

Yeah. That but now it's gone. I just don't I haven't I need to look into it. I haven't found You

James Routledge:

need you need your independent spot, or maybe we can get some people giving you some recommendations. What about, if you were going out to grab food?

Espocrespo:

I think we could both agree on the same place maybe.

Magzoncam:

Oh, I don't know.

Espocrespo:

A A sandwich club.

Magzoncam:

A sandwich club's a definite. I've got a, like, Afghan Palace.

James Routledge:

Really?

Magzoncam:

Yeah. Yeah.

James Routledge:

Yeah. No way. Good.

Magzoncam:

Like, hidden gem. Hidden gem. It's not it's not like it's cheap. It's It's sheltered. Food.

Magzoncam:

Like Cobridge on Walterby Road type of thing. But me and my friends have been there. Like, we we get, like, a little feast, and it's it's it's great. Like, that's that's,

Espocrespo:

like I

James Routledge:

love that. They're the kind of recommendations I feel like.

Magzoncam:

You ain't gonna or or, Carmen's. Can't forget Carmen's on, London Road. It's like Caribbean food. They do takeaway and stuff like, but they've been there for ages.

James Routledge:

Yeah. Decent. Love it. Yeah. And we touched on music.

James Routledge:

If you were gonna you might have already shouted them out. If you were gonna recommend some listeners or people seeing this to explore some stoked talent musically, one each.

Espocrespo:

I'm gonna have to be a bit biased here just because I'm, because I'm helping Fawn out, but we are they're working on a project. I'm gonna record it in September in Liverpool. So over the next few months, we're gonna be dropping singles. So definitely keep an eye out for that.

James Routledge:

And how does Fawn how do people find them?

Espocrespo:

On Instagram, Fawn official. So it's f o a r n. So

James Routledge:

f o a r n. Yeah. Nice. How about you?

Magzoncam:

Well, I've already shouted e out. So, there's there's actually there's so much good music coming out of the city right now.

Espocrespo:

Go on. Just

James Routledge:

go. You can have a couple. Just just

Magzoncam:

I'm gonna get shot. Forward motion. Forward. He's a singer, R and B singer, just on the come up. He also works has his own food pump plug platters.

Magzoncam:

So, yeah, that's my

James Routledge:

that's my favorite. Don't get me music out now?

Magzoncam:

Got music out now.

Espocrespo:

Everyone can be

Magzoncam:

aware that

James Routledge:

I've put you on the spot. So it's it's my fault, not theirs. And what's your, like, both you too, just your life in and around this area, what's your favorite thing to get up to? Like, if you got a free weekend?

Espocrespo:

For for me, like, I think I think it started with lockdown, to be honest. It's like when you got nothing else to do, I just like going for a walk. And I feel like Stoke has got loads of places for that flight. For me, just because of where I live, I love walking down the canal in Trenton, going to Wedgwood, Barleston back, but, like, Handchurch, Canwick.

Magzoncam:

Beautiful scenes.

Espocrespo:

There's so many places. I think it's just that it's just like sometimes when you do just need that space, I love, like, just throwing on a podcast, going for a walk, and just especially when it's a nice day, which we've actually had some nice weather recently, which always helps. It's just like, yeah, just go go out for a walk, put your headphones in. And I I feel like that's the a really good thing about Stoke Staffordshire in general. There's loads of green space.

Espocrespo:

Love it.

Magzoncam:

Mine is jumping on my back, doing the same sort of thing, or, hitting the mats. There's a lot of great, fighting gyms, especially, like, Thai boxing gyms, Mai Tai in this in the city right now. There's a lot of great fighters. Again, shout out, 1 k fitness. Shout, Sam.

Magzoncam:

A lot of great positive people in that scene.

Espocrespo:

So Cool.

James Routledge:

Yeah. That's the scene that we probably don't talk quite enough, actually. Yeah. Nice. Honestly, it's been a pleasure.

James Routledge:

I feel like everything you 2 are doing, we need more of. I feel like my the thing that would be great for me is if for 5 years, if there was, like, a 1000 more people like you 2 that are just creating and collaborating with others. That's where I feel like the potential is a 100% there. The talent's definitely there. And I hope that between us and others, we can make it feel possible.

James Routledge:

So, yeah, it's been a pleasure, and, good to have you both on.

Magzoncam:

Oh, and thanks.

Espocrespo:

Thanks for having us. Thank you for

James Routledge:

listening to the knot pod. If you like this podcast and want more, please follow us on social media at the knot daily, and subscribe to get good news from the knot direct to your inbox via www.thenot.news. Join the community, join the movement, and together, we're changing the narrative, and by doing that, we're gonna change the place. And please always remember, when you see something positive in our area, just think, that's one for the night. See you next time.

Ash (magzoncam) & Ryan (espocrespo). "We were making music for LA, from Stoke"

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